God Isn't Real

Alright. So a friend and I have been discussing this topic for a long while now and we've decided to make it public.

We don't believe in a god. We don't believe that some magical higher being each individually made us and made every other creature. The theory of evolution.
A big bang, harsh climate, the years made it more livable and microorganisms began to develop life. That's the short version of life. The longer version is more complex and clear, but what I wrote is a taste.

Earth started out from the big bang theory. Hopefully everyone knows about it.

How can there be a god? How can there be a devil? We can't go 2 hell and be miserable because that requires feeling. When we die, our nervous system dies too! Our body just lies there. People would like 2 believe that there is a savior, but there isn't. Why can't we all just know that we can't always have someone to be there. God is magic and there is no magic.

PLUS, the bible is just a book. It's not written by anyone holy, its written and rewritten by man. Cinderella is JUST AS OLD as the so called "Bible" and "Jesus" so do we believe her and that fable?

Agreed. I think I did for half of my life actually.

I don't believe in God or Jesus or anything remotely similar to a religious deity at all. Science is fact. It can be proven. :)

Heaven and Hell, the best and worst places to go to after you die....if you think about it, I don't see how they can exist. Unless Heavens having sex every day for eternity? Which most people do in real life anyway. And if Hell was the worst torture every day, forever...wouldn't it get boring? And then cease to be effective at all?

Sounds like something to scare little kids, really. Death = your body ceases to function. You decay and rot. Eventually you become what is known as Dust and Bones. It doesn't go anywhere. That's what my point of view is.

*no intentions for internet flamewars whatsoever*

"PLUS, the bible is just a book. It's not written by anyone holy, its written and rewritten by man. Cinderella is JUST AS OLD as the so called "Bible" and "Jesus" so do we believe her and that fable?"

Although Cinderella is a well-known fable, you must admit objectively that our calendar has little or nothing to do with it. Very few people are asked to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help you Cinderella. In the country I live in we do not pledge allegiance to one nation under Cinderella and our money does not have "In Cinderella We Trust" on it. I somehow do not believe these facts will make you take God any more seriously than Cinderella

Would you dismiss any testimony as how the belief in God has changed the life of a believer?

Thats not my point.

if u read it i said that Cinderella was just as old. and that its a story and so is the bible.

try reading it again, please.

It's just believing in something. But you can believe in whatever you want and believe that it actually came true. It's self confidence my dear.

So then we may agree that the point of faith has been missed by many

Would you dismiss any testimony as how the belief in God has changed the life of a believer?

Belief changes lives, yes. That is true.
BELIEF exists.

It is my opinion, however, that this actual god does not.

Mmhmm

it's nothing but your own faith. That's made by yourself

I have been inspired by the most printed book in the world, but I am not the author

No.

There are many authors. Many Editors! It's been changed to much 2 even be real. And it's too illogical.

Is the golden rule illogical?

Golden Rule as in"Do unto others as you would have them do unto you."

The thing about Religion and science is that we can only go so far with questions regarding God's existence and where these supposedly excited protons and electrons came from. We could sit here, debate for hours and angrily type over this thread, and likelihood is, we arrive back to where we started. Plus, you've not exactly left room for discussion either: "God Isn't Real". Erm, thanks.

God exists. God created man. God created our universe = pretty much sums up my faith. But I am not going to sit here and prove anything to someone who has already made their mind up. I see no point in doing so.

Personally, I'm a spiritual believer, not in a Christian "God" but in spiritual atonement through meditation and the like, and thats what works for me. I do believe that there may possibly be something higher, but I don't really push myself to follow it. I'm more of what you may call a spiritual agnostic.

I see religion merely as a method of personal comfort and guidance, and in some cases, a form of control, and shy more towards spiritual enhancement and personal knowledge rather than looking to a figure in the sky to provide everything for me. That doesn't mean I discredit religion entirely though. If what you believe helps you sleep at night, or guides you to be a better person, then, to me, its serving its purpose. Thats just my point of view though, and I'm still young and learning my place in the universe.

As for the ideas of evolution and the like. I believe that all of its very possible. However, I don't think Science was meant to explain everything, in the sense that sometimes logic, the numbers and facts, can't find the true meaning behind some of the greater things in the universe. Like, as though some things aren't meant to be understood and broken down.

But once again, I'm young, and still trying to develop my views on life.

I wasn't meant to be criticizing people's opinions. With the name of the thread, I just put a name down because I knew someone would read it.

I'm not arguing, I'm simply asking myself questions. There isn't any reason to lock this thread, just to leave it open for discussion. No one is becoming angry, we're all just putting in our views and our own set of questions.

Now,

"I see religion merely as a method of personal comfort and guidance, and in some cases, a form of control, and shy more towards spiritual enhancement and personal knowledge rather than looking to a figure in the sky to provide everything for me."

^^^THAT'S what I'm saying. You can believe in yourself. Or people pray to something.

What made me turn from Christianity was the sins and the stories and the consequences. Thou shall not lye and honor your father and mother. There are so many people in this world, even on this site, that lye and hate their parents. So many people cheat, and not as much but people kill. This made ME think, "well....why hasn't there been any consequence? Wait, how can we feel down in hell anyways."

As i got older I started to believe that hell and heaven was on earth. Hell is what you make it, Heaven is what you want. The beautiful places on earth, with your loved ones and most cherished places is a heaven for me. If i stay here on earth when I die, help my kin and watch them grow while I can also roam where ever I please, that's the heaven for me.

Hell. Hell can be the world itself! Humanity has made a living hell and changed a lot of things for battle. There is so much Greed and Misery on this planet, we can stash some and ship it to another planet when it becomes habitable. Hell and Heaven can both be on earth.
Our own map can be our palm or the North star in the sky. We can pray and pray, but the question IN MY MIND is, who am I praying too?

With the questions about evolution, maybe they'll just remain questions because God necessarily isn't the answer to everything. We just don't know.

"how was there anything created in the first place - how was the atmosphere that crashed into eachother created? Where did it come from?" << That's the biggest question because Nobody knows. Some give it one answer. Others try to find multiple answers. Truth is, we can't give it an answer because no one was around to know.

Unfortunately, this discussion might become locked, for what reason I don't know, it's a discussion and I'm enjoying peoples views. Hopefully, the topic will remain open. If people want to reply or if they don't, that's their decision.

Here's a link that MANY of you will enjoy. It's a very big discussion. >>>>>>>>>>

http://2012-comet.com/phpbb/2012/god-doesn-exist-t697.html

It takes a lot of thought. It might be one big picture or multiple pieces waiting to be put together. I'm always thinking of this. Always asking myself questions. Sometimes to write things down on a piece of paper and brainstorm is very good. This discussion is almost a brainstorm but, lol, we keep asking questions! For the next question, there should be multiple answers. Not just one from me or one from another. Brainstorm.

I don't think most believers picture God as an old man in the sky, sticking arms and legs together an putting them on earth. (Maybe some do. But not most.) Many people's faith, at least now, is very in line with scientific discovery - the two don't need to contradict each other.

As for hell, I'm not sure if I believe in it either. But I doubt it would be a physical place, experienced with the physical body. But you've lived this in everyday life. Why does your gut drop when a friend is mad at you? You're in no real danger. Why does your heart seem to swell when you're with people you love? These are feelings, set apart from the physical world. (One might make a case for the neuro-scientific connection between emotions and chemicals, but yes.)

If anything I'd expect hell to be self-created - an inability to accept the goodness of life, and so you suffer. But not physically.

I'm not judging anyone in any way, I respect everyone and I never mean to offend anyone. If I do, I'm truly sorry.

So you believe there was a Big Bang? So... You mean there was nothing and that nothing just exploded?! How could there be a Big Bang out of nothing? Something had to create that Big Bang, right?

I do believe in Darwin's Evolution Theory, I think God created species that we now don't know anymore, because nature's changed and those species developed. I believe in a combination of the two. I believe God created us and the world, but I do believe that species develop into new species.

I don't believe in the Big Bang. If there was even a Big Bang, God would have created it.

I think that in my developing relationship with my personal God, the divine Holy Trinity
I have many times confused my desires with my needs, magic with miracles, and the almighty with the fairy godmother in the ancient fable. Creation has much to do with the moral compass. Some believe the magi, wise men, or astrologers from the east. Were stars rather than the followers of a star. So far it seems that Bethlehem, Nazareth, Jerusalem and many other places in the bible are not in never-never land. Far too much blood has been shed as the Holy lands await the peace of forever and ever. The power is not in the land, but in the blood. It is not so important to use God for our own ends than to be used by God for a peaceful end.

Here's the whole story of the big bang for anyone who has the interest in reading it.

http://www.umich.edu/~gs265/bigbang.htm

The scientist and Roman Catholic priest Georges Lematre proposed what became known as the Big Bang,
though I remember that Johnny Carson said he believed what happened immediately after the big bang was the really big cigarette

Hahahaha! Michael you dog...

I once knew a dyslexic atheist that proclaimed ; there is no dog

"How can there be a god? How can there be a devil? We can't go 2 hell and be miserable because that requires feeling. When we die, our nervous system dies too! Our body just lies there."

That's why it is your soul, you leave your body behind.

"People would like 2 believe that there is a savior, but there isn't."

There is a savior, just not the one everyone envisions per say.

"the bible is just a book. It's not written by anyone holy, its written and rewritten by man."

I agree here, though it is an interesting read.

Everything we can't explain, the sun, moon, stars, our very existence, is God. If that makes someone feel good or safe or it makes them go out and be a better person, I say great, I have my own beliefs. I don't believe I ever have to enter a church to find that connection in my life or be accepted by whatever force put me here. If a God exists and he is going to overlook me because I didn't faithfully put useless money in his collection plate every Sunday, that's not someone I'd look up to anyway. Everything the world has become, we made and we are the ones who are going to fix it or destroy it. It would just be nice if peoples actions were as Godly as the words, inside of church or out.

Written by man...inspired by God

I don't believe in higher ethereal being. But I do believe that the majority of people need something to believe in. Something to give them hope in a world where hope is naught but a shadow of it's own definition.

^ So you think the world won't exist until there is a belief in the ethereal for some people?

I actually question that, I mean without the idea of the existance of God, we wouldn't have mythology, without mythology we wouldn't have philosophy, without philosophy, we wouldn't have science.

I guess I am neo descartian on this subject... LoL

Science and mathematics. logic and discussion :]

I don't exactly know what I believe in. I say that I'm a buddhist because I believe and follow Buddha's teachings but I don't know if I believe that there is a God that created everything around us.

The world is huge. I mean, there's so many things out there that we don't even know about. I don't really believe in the bible because "God" didn't write it, man did. How do you know everything in there is real? I don't want to put my faith on something that I doubt in. And there's so many things that they tell you to do and not to do. I believe everyone in this world has sinned. I truly do, I mean everyone has lied at least once in there life and we're all destroying this Earth that he created. But I don't really think there really is a right or wrong. And God has made a lot of people in this world die, and prayers don't work because I tried. If he's truly up there, watching us and what not, why doesn't he answer many peoples' prayers?

I'm not here to convince people that there is no god, but i just wanted to say my opinion on this.

God...

I'll know the answer once I stop breathing, or not...

I'll just live my life and believe in things I see fit to myself for now. Until then.

Cheers!

"In closing let me just say this, your relationship with your God is just that, yours, it is personal and should remain such, now if you want to share it with others, do it by example, your walk and smile and humanity towards others will make people gravitate to you and your understanding of your God"

^^ Exactly.

If there is indeed a god and a Satan, I'd much rather know to wonder the world for the rest of eternity because I know heaven won't open it's gates for me and hell will just grow bored trying 2 make me miserable ^_^

I'm proud for the people who explain their thoughts. Thank you. Instead of trying 2 criticize.

I seemed not to have mastered criticism because less than thirty have praised my comments on there poems. To me poetry is not the reflection of a perfect soul but rather a perfect reflection of a soul
A vessel has little use until it is touch by the flame

I owe some comment but I will be back in the mean time don't wear any shoes that do not fit
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2BjJbKQkgc

Love hurts, love scars,
Love wounds, and marks,
Any heart, not tough,
Or strong, enough
To take a lot of pain,
Take a lot of pain
Love is like a cloud
Holds a lot of rain
Love hurts
, ooh ooh love hurts

Im young, I know,
But even so
I know a thing, or two
I learned, from you
I really learned a lot,
Really learned a lot
Love is like a flame
It burns you when its hot
Love hurts, ooh ooh love hurts

Some fools think of happiness
Blissfulness, togetherness
Some fools fool themselves I guess
Theyre not foolin me

I know it isnt true,
I know it isnt true
Love is just a lie,
Made to make you blue
Love hurts, ooh,ooh love hurts
Ooh,ooh love hurts

The Achilles heel of science is that each age believes it knows everything to be known in the world. We try to skip all of the evolution in the psych as if the psych does not exist
If we reduce the human mind to random neuron firings all abstract concepts, which cannot be measured in a laboratory, are thrown out the window.

I heard a story about my father. But I cannot remember exactly how it went. It seems he was about to be punished for misconduct. He either jumped out the window, threw the paddle out the window, or maybe he threw the nun out the window.

The conflict in philosophy between the physical and metaphysical has been going on as long as civilization has existed. It seems that moral laws and civilization is what separates humans from other animals. If we are allowed the throw God out the window I am certain we will be oppressed by a less compassionate power

"I don't really believe in the bible because "God" didn't write it, man did. How do you know everything in there is real?"

^Yes, man did write the Bible, but it was inspired by God. There are many things in the Bible (new testament) that says the way that things will happen, and if someone has read it.. things that the Bible mentions really do happen. And to think that man wrote it for themselves? No. Cause man wouldn't like that long to be like "Yea, I told you that was going to happen. I wrote it in the Bible."

"And God has made a lot of people in this world die, and prayers don't work because I tried. If he's truly up there, watching us and what not, why doesn't he answer many peoples' prayers?"

^God didn't 'make' a lot of people die. People make their own decisions, some not too good. For others, it's just their time. Prayer doesn't work for petty little things. If you don't really know if a "God" does exist, then why pray? It's like you're testing God and that's something that's not supposed to be questioned. He tests us. If he answered many peoples prayers, then there wouldn't be such thing as faith.

I'm a strong believer in God. My father is a preacher. There's no doubt that everyone has sinned but we're supposed to recognize our mistake, repent, and make things better.

What you believe in is you decision. I'm not the kind that shoves Christ down anybody's throat but I do love to get the word out.

"""""I don't really believe in the bible because "God" didn't write it, man did. How do you know everything in there is real?"

^Yes, man did write the Bible, but it was inspired by God. There are many things in the Bible (new testament) that says the way that things will happen, and if someone has read it.. things that the Bible mentions really do happen. And to think that man wrote it for themselves? No. Cause man wouldn't like that long to be like "Yea, I told you that was going to happen. I wrote it in the Bible."

"And God has made a lot of people in this world die, and prayers don't work because I tried. If he's truly up there, watching us and what not, why doesn't he answer many peoples' prayers?"

^God didn't 'make' a lot of people die. People make their own decisions, some not too good. For others, it's just their time. Prayer doesn't work for petty little things. If you don't really know if a "God" does exist, then why pray? It's like you're testing God and that's something that's not supposed to be questioned. He tests us. If he answered many peoples prayers, then there wouldn't be such thing as faith.

I'm a strong believer in God. My father is a preacher. There's no doubt that everyone has sinned but we're supposed to recognize our mistake, repent, and make things better."""

Man did write the bible, so they must of written it for themselves to keep the "rules" in-line. Lots of predictions have come true and a lot have been combined with the Mayans. (old old community that had the most accurate view of the future) Yes, they did have inspiration. A collaboration of views from many people and the world around them.

this God killed his own son. That's pretty damn equal to the amount of people who have died. Person vs person or person vs nature.

Although theologians have puzzled over the mystery of the Divine Trinity
The Son as a divine member had the power not to sacrifice himself

Modern humans have sensed a Higher Power and have been building altars as long as civilization has been recorded

The word god means "to sacrifice to" and the Christ sacrificed himself to the world
To conquer the death of the Spirit
"Lord forgive them for they know not what they do."

Wow. i bet that pissed a lot of people off...

I like the story of Jesus because I think it screams what we as people are about. We search to no end for answers and when we declare we have found it, we destroy it. Yeah he sacrificed himself on one hand, on the other we killed him and somewhere in the middle is the truth no one really wants to see. We all want truth that bends around our own beliefs.

You know a Jehovah's Witness came to me and told me that Jesus died for my sins...

I said "Wow... Really! Then why does hell still exist"

The guy quickly changed the subject... I couldn't hold my laughter at his reaction to my question...

I mean if he died for my sins it would mean whatever I've done and will do will be erased, and its not fair, in some respects...

I didn't know they believed hell was a place of torment

^^^ lol Noir

Very good question to ask yourself. i wouldn't know considering im atheist.

BUT like i said b4, man made the bible.

but if there are more then one spiritual being, then the bible is wrong. Again, there are more then one bible. These bibles are all for different religions and make rules and stories of the gods they worship.

More then one bible.
More then one god.
Man made.

It's just a human trend to me.