Penalties and Warnings

I have a question... When a member blatantly breaks the rules, either on a forum arena or the private messaging system, and you KNOW the member knows the rules, why are constant warnings given?

Warnings mean nothing to members unless it's in a specific setting, such as a forum where things are bordering along the lines of something that could cross a line. Not when people call specific names (say I was a called a stupid bitch in a private message.. that to me would generate a penalty). However, when someone in a forum starts arguing a bit, then I could see a warning being okay. But to consistently warn the same members over and over of the SAME infraction, that they may or may not get a penalty? It's ridiculous, and I see that now. I may have been guilty of it as a mod, because I was a mod for too long and forgot what it was like to be a member. But from knowing both sides now - warnings mean jack. You keep warning members and they'll keep walking all over you and the rules.

I think we as a site need to discuss this, because I know a lot of people are unhappy with the way things are going, as it doesn't make any sense. First it's lenient, then it's cracked down, with no proof of it, and warnings are tossed all over the place. Either we can break rules with a slap on the wrist, or we break rules and get penalized.

Does this have anything to do with Kay? I think warnings are given because sometimes a certain member doesn't mean to break a rule or mean disrespect. Not to mention things get carried away and posts can be read and understood in more than one way and hence it would be fair to warn the member first. especially if the member isn't a trouble maker or known to cause trouble. I'm lost here. Did I miss something?

No, warnings through threads and what not make sense to me (in my head anyway). Nothing to do with Kay.

But, when in a private message, someone calls someone else a specific name (that is clearly disrespectful) and only gets a warning... after warning.. after warning... how does that make sense?

Say I PM'd you and called you a lying, hypocritical bitch (this is only an example, you know I don't think you're any of those lol). You had said nothing to me personally to generate that, I was just irritated at something you said on the main boards. Obviously I know the rules and know that's not okay, and 100% disrespectful, especially if we were known to not be friends. Wouldn't that warrant a penalty? I'd sure hope I'd be penalized for something like that.

It would warrant a penalty of course. I thought they had penalties and penalty boxes and whatnot for all kinds of people going out of line on the main boards, let alone in pms. so someone is bothering you and you keep complaining their pm and they just get warnings and keep on bothering you? That's disgusting.

I think the special treatment towards certain members should seize and the mods should look at the cases before them as they would had it been from any other member they don't know. But then I've been saying since forever and nothing happens.

Oh you're talking about 'warning #1' bit?

I think those are warnings of the topic becoming too heated and if it doesn't calm back down. Or the topic doesn't get back on track it will be locked to prevent it from getting out of hand. I think the 3 strike rule is great as it locks a thread and allows (or should allow) people to cool off before they truly say something penalty worthy.

If you're talking about general warnings like "Amanda you have your first warning for speaking to a member in such a manner." then yes I agree with you. If someone is disrespecting you either on the forums or via PM yes penalties should be given. I don't even think warnings should be given if someone is resorting to name calling. Adults know when they cross the line, name calling is one of those things that shouldn't get a warning but an immediate penalty. Mind you these are only my thoughts on that kind of thing.

I agree with the thread bit, though I don't think it should have to be per one thread or even daily.

Say every day for a week, I was in different things, slinging crap, being rude and stirring crap up for no reason. I got warned twice in every thread I did this in, but stopped just before I got my penalty. Don't you think that should warrant penalty, anyway? Everyone knows I know the rules (as should any member who has been here for any period of time, especially years).

Sometimes I say things that I don't mean to sound rude, but it's the internet and unless I put stupid smileys and ridiculous lol's after each post (which I made myself get into a habit so people would stop getting offended) then people can't necessarily understand the tone of what I'm saying. If I said something that's borderline rude/disrespectful (no matter my intent), THEN I see a warning making sense. But specific rule breaking should be penalized, especially when it's WAY over the line, not dancing along it.

I agree with Amanda. On a side note however, I think threads aren't much of a problem because whatever is posted on there is there for everyone to see and everyone gets to have a say and opinion in the whole situation, not to mention can voice a disagreement with the decision taken and push for other serious measure to be taken. However pms are more of a problem considering you can say almost anything on there and it's mainly between you, the mods and the person who you're addressing and hence if the mods, or at least the one addressing the subject is bias towards the person then you're pretty much done for, which isn't fair. I think this is a subject that needs to addressed seriously.

^That could be tricky, but there are some pretty clear cut rules for PM's.

-If you swear at someone, that's penalty worthy even if it's in a PM.

-If it has been requested that you refrain from PMing someone, subsequent attempts start to be counted as harassment.

When PM's are complained on, are they discussed with all the mods, or is it up to the mod that retrieves it first? (Things may have changed, I'm not sure).

Mostly it's the mod who sees it first - otherwise things would never get done. But in some situations, if one of us isn't sure of what to do, we'll talk about it.

Bob, I think you have trouble comparing your own actions to those of others. From an outside perspective, it often looks like you see a perceived insult, and then respond with exaggerated vulgarities. While you (since you are involved) might feel that the two actions are equal, in the eyes of "the law" one might be allowable while the response isn't. People are allowed to disagree with. They are allowed to say "I think you're wrong, and here's why." They are allowed to say "You are being unreasonable," or "You are being mean." They're even allowed to whine. What they aren't allowed to do is profanely attack someone personally. Those aren't equal. The difference is that one statement addresses a thought or an issue or an argument, while the other points directly to a person. It's a weird line, when we're looking to allow discussions but not allow harassment, but the line is there.

-Sibyllene

That's not rational, the example is too extreme it doesn't fit the situation, it's more like a car accident, you don't get your license suspended immediately (unless in certain cases).

I don't think that if someone pm'ed you should curse them back, especially if you know this wouldn't be tolerated on the main boards and would be deleted. So why go around it and pm it anyway? You have the right to respond but not in a disrespectful way, now if the original pm wasn't respectful then you can always report it. or ignore it. nothing comes out of insults after all.

Bob, you do realize that if someone else did or said 99% of the things you do and say, they would be suspended and possibly IP banned, and never to be seen again? People have been suspended for much less.

If you're implying that I do or say things that I get away with and should be getting suspended for...I have no clue what you're talking about. I don't "get away" with anything.

Why does everything have to be about "getting even" with you? I really don't understand. I don't care what you did as a mod, I'm not attacking anyone for that. I'm saying that you cross the line plenty of times and get repeatedly warned.. when you know you know the rules.

"So basically you're saying it's ok for Michael Nalley to call someone an asshole under the guise of literary humor, but it's wrong for someone else to liyerally call some an asshole....hmmmmm"

Pretty much, yes. Think of it as a chance to be more literary with your insults.

"and I had a little respect for you as a mod before yesterday, but you're no different then the rest, you had a chance to prove your mettle yet you did nothing, course it was ok in your book, because it wasn't me attacking one of your club members or friends, but it was me being slandered, that's exactly all I'm talking about here, equality the whole way through. Justify your favoritism and partiality any way you want, but it stinks and the atench runs far......"

Do you mean with Kay's thread? I honestly thought that the two of you were buddies, and that is was one of those friendly jibes. Once it was said that this wasn't true, the comment was removed.

"you wanna do something to get rid of all the dumb shit, try being fair across the board, not just with your personal special interests............that's all I'm asking, that's all many are asking, but you and the others can't here them, because your judgements are severly clouded by those with their noses up your collective butts"

I think fairness is an issue, but perhaps not in the way you think. You, for example, can get away with more than the average member, for two reasons. One is that you have been here for a long time, and have contributed much, and people are hesitant to see that go. The other way you are given leniency is precisely -because- you are a "dissenting" member. People take special care with you, because we have the idea that a "troublemaker" in a community is valuable. We count on people like you to point out weaknesses and be the devil's advocate. We have to tiptoe around, because people might easily think that any penalty you garner is simply because we don't like you. Conversely, we have to be sure to be strict with our friends, because otherwise we will be accused of favoritism. Do you see how that works? You get more special care than anybody else I have seen on this site. If you want it to stop, let us know.

I never said I was an angel, not on this website or in real life. I was simply stating that you definitely get away with a lot more than anyone else on this site does, and I'm not the only one who says it. Of course not everyone will chime in who agrees with me here because they have to deal with attacks, and not from just you, I'm not singling you out there.

This wasn't meant to be personal. I'm stating my opinion per what each person is posting when I have something to say. Feel free to say whatever you want to me, but if you've been holding it in check for this long it's probably for a reason.

"garbage, personally I'd love to go, I wish you'd suspend me forever for valid reasons of course, you'd make my life much better. So why do I stay, because I love the site probably more than most and I dedicated 7 years to it. But don't coddle me, I don't need no favors from any of you, everyone should be treated the same."

Very well.

I'm talking directly to you now. If that is your version of being singled out, then yes, I suppose I am singling out... though it's a discussion between the two of us back and forth.

ENOUGH! This is getting us no where and this thread is being locked.