Weekly contest suggestions, part deux

Carry on in here, folksies.

I am not sure if there is much more that could be said or if there is we will be looking at thread part 58

so whilst I am here I am going to sing a song from the life of brian

ok

uh hum

'always look on the bright side of life

whistle

whistle
whistle whistle whistle

'always look on the bright side of .......

oh crap, forgotten the words.....

of to google methinks.........

I liked the 'Part Deux' .. It sounds catchy as a title.

^^ its French LP :)

I don't have anything to say than what i have read in the previous thread and there some who take things and over exaggerate (no offence to anyone). But this is primarily the reason why I stay out of discussions, thus turning into a debate that has no point and further implications :S

Well ok, ok, you don't HAVE to continue : )

I just cut it off when it seemed like people were still posting big posts, so I didn't want to be all dictatory.

Sibs or any mods, I don't think I have heard anyone criticize my #2 suggestion in the previous thread, which could very well work out as a soln to judging fatigue /avoidance. Hey, I am willing to volunteer as a judge again if you limit me to once a month on a rotation basis. There should be quite a few others who may like it, so why not take a vote for volunteers and see how many otherwise unwilling otherwise well qualified potential judges come forward to help out. I will repaste my suggestions 2, 3 from the other thread to debate/comment/criticize below:

"2) Judging fatigue can be reduced effectively by increasing the judging pool and letting the judging panel rotate each week as suggested above and previously suggested in similar threads many times. e.g. For the 3 months in consideration choose 12-15 judges and offer them 1 week each per month (only 3 x in 3mths)....not too stressful at all for many. I think this will bring forth a number of busy but otherwise talented members (incl. untalented me) who cannot commit a whole block of 3 months, week after week. Also, many on the list may even agree to back up if someone from the panel for that week is unable to at the last moment. Then in the subsequent 3-month term, one if a new pool cannot be formed, allow the volunteers from the old pool to continue....many might elect to.
3) Judges can be up to 5 (i.e 3-5) any given week depending on how many are willing each week. A larger judging panel will eliminate the issue of favoritism in most weeks, as used to be. So less bickering on this issue."

The weekly rotations in the pre-selected judging panel for the term (3 mths) should not be difficult for mods, using the powertools they have, don't they already do it to get subs in place anyway? I think a lot of people can be recruited if the judging rotations were to take place as suggested above.

Neither suggestion would need Janis, would it? so simple to enact, if agreed upon.

I think it's possible, it would just take a fair bit of logistical organization. Last term, our judging pool had about 8 people in it. Maybe only doing a week at a time would make more people volunteer, I'm not sure.

But we would need to set up a schedule, notify people when their week was, remind them when it was coming up, get subs if they forgot it was their week and they can't do it anymore, promote and demote people as needed, remind them of rules, and check to make sure they did it right. It's not impossible, I'm just saying... we don't exactly work regular hours, here, and it might be hard to make sure (in advance) that there will always be a mod around during the weekend as we're needed, especially if we're bringing in a new crowd every week (it generally takes a few weeks for things to settle into place, as it is). Basically, I'm not saying "no," and this is just my perspective, but these are issues that would have to be considered.

Bloody hell, I missed all this out

"Cheer up, Brian. You know what they say; Some things in life are bad, They can really make you mad. Other things just make you swear and curse, When you're chewing on life's gristle, Don't grumble, give a whistle, And this'll help things turn out for the best, hey, Always look on the bright side of life, Always look on the light side of life,........"

To be honest I don't think weekly rotations is a practical solution...

As Sibs intimated and as I've said before it would be too hard to manage and monitor.

Increasing the judging pool would sufice the way David mentioned..but Im not sure if possible...needs a lot of management and attention...no? From the mods and the judges, equally..

I still think my rotation idea would work (5 judges 3 vote each week), I don't think we would get enough numbers for Lonely Souls idea to work and there might be problems for other reasons. Especially since we were supposed to have 3 judges instead of 5.

In this thread or at least by the end of it we should probably make a list of the suggestions and then get the mods opinion on them or vote or whatever

WHY CAN'T WE NOMINATE ON SATURDAYS?
:/

LP its so the judges have time to read and pick their top three. Some judges vote Friday night or saturday to get it in on time.

Thanks for the info! Yes, it's best for them. I have lost a vote though :/

Why did you yell...!!

And you should only have one anyway... No good voting just for the sake of it... Don't you understand that's part of the problem...?

NICKO, YOU ARE YELLING WRONG. CAPITALS, SEE? IT'S ALL IN THE CAPITALS.

Maybe he wasn't voting just to vote - maybe he had a poem in mind and was waiting to make sure nothing else came up, first. Or maybe he just stumbled on one. Yup yup.

But yeah.... Britt nailed it.

Here's a question - why do I keep ending up on the Internet? I'm supposed to be reading.

Yes of course Sibs, but can always be nominated the following week, if it was a late entry...

I was saving my last vote for something that's remarkable, and it didn't came... not until yesterday :)

Well you can nominate it next week..

Yeah yeah, I wasn't yelling anyway :p
i forgot m,y caps on

Yeah yeah, I wasn't yelling anyway :p
i forgot m,y caps on

Yes of course you did.... Silly me..

Haha, ohmygod, Nicko and Abed...

I am still with Colm, I support his thought. We could just try it, we won't lose a thing. It's messy both ways, so yup.

I decided to bring this up again because it petered out (surprise surprise) but the problems seem to be remaining, a la this weeks contest thread. Mel and Sibs responded in the discussion but nothing came of it. It's as if I'm flogging a dead horse here by keeping on about the contest all the time but I'd like a mod or someone who is in control of the contest to seriously consider these thoughts/suggestions and actually do something constructive. I try keeping it short.

Things we can do without needing Janis:

1. Rotation of judges (mentioned loads of times above) on a 5 week rotation with set number of 3 judges each week.

2. Sub/mod breaks tie-breaks instead of computer.

3. New host (preferably a mod): Nana has done it for ages. Why preferably a mod? Only they and the judges should be able to see the votes and have voting powers imo.

4. Introduction of a general judging criteria/judge training/making sure the judges clearly know the procedures, rules, expectations, etc.

Things we need Janis for:

5. Nomination list should be arranged chronologically as it briefly was before, not randomising each time.

6. Number of nominations?

1. All the suggestions involving rotation of judges demands additional dedication to the task of scheduling communication & cross-checking. It also requires more volunteer judges than we have had in ages. The argument is that if you build a better contest, judges will make a path to your door.

IF someone is willing to undertake this task, please come forward.

2. We tried the mod/sub tie breakers and the result was that more errors were introduced due, in part, to the software/site glitch. We discussed this a few weeks ago and the consensus was that unless fewer than three judges vote, the mods would not add their votes plus the site would break ties.

3. Anyone volunteer? I won't speak for the other mods, but I will not run the contest.

4. If Nana would post her message to new judges it would be helpful. Whatever additional advice we can get from anyone can be useful.

5. Agreed - either chronological or alphabetical.

6. We've rehashed this # of noms issue repeatedly with no clear consensus.

Thanks for the response Larry.

1. I don't really buy into the idea that a judges rotation is that complicated. This should be easy to follow:

Judges are given a letter each, A, B, C, D and E.
Post the below rota on a sticky thread here in the members message forum so that the judges can refer to it. Also, pm them this with the schedule including the dates. A mod could take away voting rights for the 2 judges who aren't voting on that particular week.

Week 1: A, B, C judge.
Week 2: A, B, D judge.
Week 3: C, D, E judge.
Week 4: A, C, E judge.
Week 5: B, D, E judge.

The rotation begins again for the 6th week. With a sub (either a mod or a judge who isn't judging that week, say judge E on week 1) to step in if for some exceptional or unforseen reason there are only 2 judges able to vote that week.

2. 'We tried the mod/sub tie breakers and the result was that more errors were introduced due, in part, to the software/site glitch.'
^^
I don't mean to sound smart or cheeky but, when were their ever more errors than there have been recently? As previously mentioned when I was a judge we had subs and there was very rarely any problems.

3. I don't think it should just be a case of 1st person to volunteer gets the job (not sure if thats what you mean). If none of the 5 mods can do it, maybe have a nomination process like we do when selecting judges.

4. I wouldn't mind drawing up a set of guidelines or whatever in consultation with the mods before the next judges rotation if it would help.

5. Agreed

6. 'We've rehashed this # of noms issue repeatedly with no clear consensus.'
^^
True, scratch it from the list for the moment, that's why I put the question mark after it.

4. If Nana would post her message to new judges it would be helpful. Whatever additional advice we can get from anyone can be useful.

^
which of the messages are you reffering to :P I have different copies lol...no seriously could you elaborate ?

I have an idea!

This is a "to-do" for Janis, but it would probably be helpful if the judges could see their own vote.

For instance, a judge sends their stuff to Nana, and all five judges now have their comments in, but we're missing a set of votes. Judges go back and revote, and one judge finds they didn't actually vote, just thought they did (I was guilty of this once before, I thought I voted and didn't).

So if judges could see their own votes, that'd be helpful to make sure their vote 1. actually counted and they did vote, and 2. went to the right poem before sending all the comments to Nana.

Regarding Colm's #3

One of the reasons we wanted a non-mod host was to be a bridge between mods and other members. We didn't know if it would be good to have all the "power" in the hands of mods alone.

Regarding #4, I think this is what you mean. Let me know if you were meaning something different.

These are the guidelines that we send out to new judges once they have accepted their position:

"Hey Judge!

You've been made an Expert, which has given you a new power that you might not understand just yet - but you will. This is an explanatory "how-to" message made special for you.

1. General Judging Guidelines

-Throughout the week, read through the poems that have been nominated for the contest. These can be found under the "Contest Nominations" link on the right sidebar. You may or may not wish to keep a tally of your top choices. Just make sure you have read all the poems before voting. The new color change helps with this process.

-You can vote for any poems that show up on the nominations page, regardless of date.

-Pick your top 3 poems, and rank them from favorite to least favorite of the three.

-Assign points by clicking one of the new "vote" buttons that you will see under the poem. You will see a button for 10 points, one for 7, and one for 4. Give 10 to what you feel is the best poem, etc.

-After voting, draft a private message with the titles of the 3 poems that you picked, and write a comment for each poem. Use this layout for each of your 3 picks:

"Poem," by author

"Comment comment comment." (Points given).

-Send a copy of this message to the PnQ Mod Account, as well as the current contest host, Ms. Sunshine. http://www.poems-and-quotes.com/author.html?id=302627

2. Deadlines and Important Stuff to Know

-Votes must be in by Saturday at noon, P&Q time. Do not vote before Friday, unless you have particular circumstances and alert the contest manager as early as possible.

-If votes are not submitted by noon on Saturday, a mod or substitute judge will know it is ok for them to vote.

-If you cannot comment one week, do not vote either. Let a moderator know as early as possible and someone will cover for you. If you wait until Saturday at noon, PnQ time to notify the contest manager or a moderator, you will possibly be demoted and replaced as a judge.

-If you cannot comment for three or more weeks during your judge term, you will be demoted and replaced as a judge.

-If you want to vote on the same poem you voted on in the previous week, you must ask the contest manager to place the vote for you. Let them know as soon as possible.

-If you ask a someone to place a vote for you, it counts as one of your three votes. You may not use your leftover vote on an additional poem.

-KEEP YOUR JUDGING SECRET. This helps us protect the integrity of the contest.

3. Poems that should not be voted on:
-Your own poem
-Poems from the explicit section (that require 18 and over viewers).
-Two or more of the same poem (as in the case of collaborations).

4. Self-harm poems:

-Though Janis did not wish to see poems of this type on the front page, we have determined that they ought to be allowed. However, they should really only be voted on in cases where the poems showcase true literary merit, not glorification of self-harm.

Please read through this (I know it's a lot, sorry!) and message back if you have any questions.

Thank you so much! This contest would be impossible without you.

-All the Mods"

Britt.... I like your idea.

-Sibyllene