Atomized families

A mother comes in & her concern is that her children will no longer have a father, because he's left them and moved out of state.
Another is concerned that her husband's anger at her is being transferred onto her children, so their relationship with him has become traumatic. Many deplore the fact that the absentee dad refuses to abide by the agreed or ordered visitation schedule: if he can't just pop in whenever he feels like it, it's not worth being there. Meanwhile these children are abandoned to the tides of anxiety and cold-hearted manipulation. They are primed to be formed into weapons of social destruction against whatever objects are perceived to be the ultimate cause of their misery.
Given the situation, where do we go from here?

I don't know, but in my opinion is better for a relationship to split if the marriage is not working out, instead of getting towards a traumatic relationship.

Either way, the children will be the ones affected, but hopefully, if both parents care and love their children, they will figure out a way so that their kids will be affected the less.

But I assume in some cases, the parents don't care. So I don't know.

What exactly do you mean by " where do we go from here"?

As in what can we do for those children?

I would want to focus on the growing children, the parents-they're already adults and they're free to do what they think is best to satisfy their "wills and drives" as long as they accept the consequences. We can only judge. But the children should be given a medium to cope with the loss. Every child needs a higher influence to help them cope with the world; both mentally and emotionally. Al though I do trust that a physical presense is almost necessary, they could also be nurtured during their childhood by reading the the proper books (personally, I experienced my own internal growth reading russian lit), and having a good tool on how to express their feelings. They should very well conduct communities for people with similar experiences/situations, they need to be in touch with their own self, their own predicament and further learn themselves and what they want to be. I'm afraid of media and how it could easily corrupt children...

in my country, I often pass by a poor public school near home. This schools bears about 70 students in a small room that could only fit about 30 chairs. And al though I trust the teachers trying their best to teach these kids, whenever I see them walk back home, it doesn't seem likely that they are indeed learning. I see the kids spit on the side walk, push each other jokingly towards the road, dance Gangnam style and shout cuss words to the other drivers, they jay walk without looking at both sides of the road, they don't even use the overpass. Even if I assume they are taught proper conduct and proper behavior, they are clueless on where to get their higher influences. If they don't get it from their gambling drunk parents, they should probably get it from the media. And sadly the media offered for the poor families here are almost a tool to brainwash them into buying commercial products, instead of proper education. Even just a slow inclining eduction to first help them understand what their existence means in the world.

I suppose I'm attempting to resolve a better response for these kids than is now happening. Not a global solution, but perhaps a personal one.

Abandonment is more of a serious problem than people realize. The studies consistently show that a boy whose father has not been a part of his life is 10 times more likely to be in trouble with the law as an adolescent. Girls in the same position are much more likely to become entangled in an abusive relationship as an adolescent. There are more issues but the core problem is lack of fathering.

Suggestions?

I think it was the summer of 92 the youngest daughter of my oldest sister was sitting on the couch asking me if I knew any good names. My niece was about six months along and she named her second child Glenn Michael ---- and passed away a few days latter after giving birth , making a nuclear family very difficult for her widow to maintain. For the most part my niece was raised in a dis-functional family with Super Colliding parents. Last year I received word that Glenn Michael (known as Mike to all of his loved ones was shot and killed by a heroic cop that found himself hanging on the door of his car while Mike was running scared. I see no advantage to pointing a finger at anyone , though Mikes family did not break up on their own like the kid in Florida shot by a nutty neighborhood dude. They say it takes a village to raise a child , but too many children are dying in the hoods. Brotherhoods, and neighborhoods that are not even waring hoods. I tend to expect a lot more of the responsibility of stressed youths to higher ranking adults. Sorry if that offends anyone

^Really sorry to hear about your family tragedy, Mike. Always wondered, why not rubber bullets, why real one's? Why not have both kinds...to avoid fatalities where only an arrest and questioning will suffice.

Anyway, one way to look at your qn., Larry is what is promoting abandonment?
For years here in the US, it was thought that this problem was only within a certain community...lack of fathering and irresponsible breeding when too young. However, I believe the attitudes in the younger generation regardless of race or poverty status, are fast changing about marriage. Plus the "gay revolution" and changing perceptions, all of which slowly but definitely add up to dissolving the institution of marriage. So, this may be an answer to your qn in part, as to why the abandonment.
Divorce rates are at all time high (? 50% overall across all age groups) and marriage rates are at an all-time low (just 51% of all couples).
Are attitudes towards marriage changing? A 2010 survey found nearly 40 percent of responders said marriage is "becoming obsolete."

The easy escape from marital or parental commitments in our society today with no one to remind them of their parental duties further festers this irresponsible behavior. Plus the epidemic proportions of an ever evolving society corrupted by easy sex, alcohol and drugs.

I wish there were easy answers, but to me without the intervention of the church and the government, the latter by making stricter laws to monetarily punish the irresponsible may be one way to go for now. Another way maybe for the community to organize fathering/mothering groups/mentors for such children in a much bigger way than what exists today.

Bottom line, I don't think it is going to get any better anytime soon.

No the bottom line has nothing to do with statistics or why the kids are in this situation or the fact that it is systemic & too big to deal with.

The bottom line is that, like all situations, there are human beings caught up in this crisis as we speak. Many of us are in contact either with them or their caretakers, sometimes on a regular basis.

How do we help those individuals? I'm not asking to solve the underlying problems, but what personal advice can we give these persons to ease their plight even a bit?

I'm willing to bet many people reading this thread are or have been in the same situation. What can you tell us?

A very nice issue has been brought forth.

While I have yet to take on responsibilities, I cannot provide adequate input. I will provide the data from my experience. The people that I have come across have almost always received the same suggestion from me. It is to stop thriving on self pity. Nothing now can be undone, regardless of how much they want to. It is futile to dwell on the past, rather he/she is baring the consequences, which only indicates that they start to cultivate a mentality where they think about the consequences. I actually try talking them into opening up. I dont directly given them a goal but project a scenario, subconsciously manipulating their mentality into breeding optimism. Taking control of their life.

From time to time we come across people who want to lead a normal life. They hail from families where parents came home drunk and quarreled. Split up after there was nothing left to fight about. The child is raised with a step parent who may or may not provide nourishment of any sort. People being molested by family members. Such people will feel lost in life, as though they dont belong. Such an individual could have any number of problems. In many a cases those individuals grow up normally and without issues. But individuals with issues are a large number. They get into drinking, drugs, gangs and so on. They want to feel normal, feel loved, change for better, but they do not know whom to approach and where to start. Plus it requires surplus amount of patience. And in some cases a firm hand. Depending upon the personality of the individual I tell them if they are ready to start. Individuals that are mentally stable, that want to change are often told to accept change. Settle down, have a family instead of jumping from partner to partner. Earn a living and provide and complete the family. The love of a good woman and children can change a man, no matter how outlined he is. I talk to them about having a job and a family.

Waking upto their spouse in bed in the early morning. Having a delicious breakfast with them. Then driving to work. Driving back from work, spending the evening with the kids, helping them with homework, taking a walk with their spouse. Tucking the children in bed. Watching them grow, setting up a curfew. Having the talk with them. Seeing them go off to college. Growing old together with their spouse. What is more normal than this?. . . . Such a scenario when calmly explained, somehow helps on a subconscious level, or at least that is what I have observed. It kick starts the process. Provide affection and have it reciprocated. Change is slow and must be accepted. Certain mistakes are irreversible. It is nice to have a caring parent cultivating values. Reassuring a child that it is okay to fall while trying to walk. Also it is necessary that they continue.

I grew up in a normal family with over protective parents. So my knowledge is based on observation and personal experience. I tend to emphasis on the consequence that would occur after executing a decision. And on eliminating self loathing. Since it leads into depression. They must not pity themselves, the society functions as a competitive platform and it is better to be slow than find a corner to sit and cry. Thus, my advice is applicable only after I study an individual.

Although I'd like to see what solutions spring up, since I cannot think of a particular solution resulting in a ripple effect.

What do you suggest, Larry?

With all due respect I have found many things that work good on paper often fail the test of time

^ That is because a theory is an assumption, the most practical and plausible. Each individual is different, even if he/she seems to portray general characteristics on the surface. And, most paper work fail for the obvious reason that every individual must be molded with values during the phases of growth from an infant to an adult, which have been neglected in many cases. Beliefs are hard to direct or eliminate. One cannot reason an individual out of something that he/she wasnt reasoned into. Plus one must will their survival and continuous existence. You can change only those who want to change. Most give up, lacking patience. It is hard to justify morals, explaining someone the necessity of bearing ethics, the benefits of enduring the struggles of living an honest life.

I like the way you think and don't take this the wrong way , but if I was to have stopped feeling sorry for myself assuming I am not set in my ways like an old dog a master tried to teach new tricks, there would be many that doubt you put the desire in my heart to change my ways. I was thinking that if a cop were to grab the door of some of the cars my great nephews uncle used to drive the cop would be dead and my nephew would be be in prison for murder. I have rated many self harm poems and tried to show many troubled teens that someone cares . I have found no way to reach forgiveness without forgiving and the most powerful spiritual tool I can think of is contrition . As the nutty neighborhood watch captain said in so many words; I am sorry I killed your Son but it was the Father's will?

One is allowed to have his/her moments. Its only natural. But letting your sentiments dwell on the past is futile. What was future yesterday, is now the present today, and shall be the past tomorrow. While you can only join the dots looking backwards in life, would it not be advisable to construct your future by taking cautions in the present? Getting upset and staying home for a week or two when someone close expires, is valid. But self injury on the basis of not being able to go out with your crush is silly. Our prison of sorrow is built by us. Where joy is, woe must accompany. It is inevitable. Just as the night follows day.

An individual cannot spend the rest of his/her adult life feeling sorry for himself or herself. It is simply redundant. The society shows no mercy. People bicker about daily life and how they have no motivation to carry on. But carrying on when one has no hope left, is what defines his/her maturity. That is what maturity is.

An abandoned child cannot be told that its okay to cry for the rest of his or her life. That individual must be prepared to face the world, as he/she one day will have to. They cannot come back home and sit crying for not getting a job. They must be thought to stand up for themselves, else they'd be crippled by the weight of the world. Just because they are alone does not make them abnormal. They may not have a continuous chain of family members before them, but they can ensure a future generation of a stable family. Settling down it seems, is the only decision that I can think of that would help them regain stabilization about their belief in a family, where they'd get to play the roles of a parent, eventually achieving a sense of satisfaction and achievement, since they'd be providing via a job. What else can you think of to make them believe in a regular family life?. .Should one wait alone until someone comes along to show affection?. .or should I say pity? ..Although no man ever has enough that he can pity someone else. But still.

The present generation running the society is primarily cunning, and then intelligent.

Today I had to advise a young mother with two kids, 1 & 3. Her husband took off yesterday & said he'd see the kids once or twice a year. She's worried about her kids growing up without a dad. She was willing to give up all pride to reconcile despite his daily abuse.
I gave her the advice about divorce, as I had to, but then I just talked to her bout the kids. She was so worried about their dad not being there that she did not understand how badly they were raised with him there.
We talked about the issues discussed in this thread & the risks involved. We talked about the lessons the kids learn by watching their dad beat their mom. It was hard to decide which was the worse.
I told her my opinion that the studies don't tell the full story. Of the kids without dads, why do some avoid the pitfalls? Perhaps they have another male figure helping to father them - a grandfather, uncle, or such. Perhaps they have perceptive mothers who are attuned to their needs, who listen to them & help them work through issues.

This is what has me thinking, that both situations differ but they arrive to something similar.

my reply is base on observations:

1) A mother comes in & her concern is that her children will no longer have a father, because he's left them and moved out of state.

In this situation, This are my questions.

Did the father ran away? as in, he is not providing to the family? has he "freed" himself from his responsibility?

Or the father simply moved to another place, but he still supports his family economically? meaning, he is just not in love with his wife, but he cares for his children.

For instance, in the case where the father freed himself from his responsibility, the mom will have to be both roles, the father and the mother. She has to work while at the same time take care of her children. In this case, she has a tough challenge, however, in my opinion, she needs to talk to her children and tell them the reality. Of course, she has to find the best approach to tell them while she does that she needs to remain calm, that way her children will be affected less.

How to remain calm? it's easy to say but I think that's where feeling not pity comes into play. She needs to embrace herself, and find the strength that she needs within her children. That way, if she is calm she will show that she is control of the situation and her children will not feel too bad. ( they will feel sadness and many other feelings, but eventually, they will move on, it will take time.)

I feel her children needs to know what happened, just so that they can understand her mom and also help her out. And I guess, the mom could seek help from her children's school psychologist on what is the best way to tell her children that their father left them. I'm considering each child's age and I think that it will also play a role on how the children will react to the situation. If the children are really young( babies), I guess it's best to not tell them. Eventually, she will have to.

Another thing, now she will be a single mom, Does she has family? perhaps she could seek help from them. May be she has more options.

On the other scenario where the father supports the children economically but he moved away, then the mom will have less of a burden. Though, She will have to do the same as the above example to find the strength and not pity herself, perhaps find a job.. Also she will have to find the way to tell her children what happened, but hopefully, the father will also interact or both of them will come to a mutual accord.

But above all, Like Gaurav said, in both cases, the moms will need to gather strength and not pity themselves. I keep thinking that they will have to tell the children the situation. However, how they tell them is the key. And communication all the time is important.

Some cases are tougher than others, but in every case, someone will have to seek help. Either from family members, from entities, or spiritually. They need to realize that they are not the only ones, they are not alone. Many go through similar situations and that it is possible to come afloat. But for that they need to put effort and not sink in depression.

On another thing,
I seriously don't think that a lack of having a father plays a role on how a child will behave in the future. There a many single woman who have raise their children and the children were well raised. And the same goes, with single fathers raising their children. In my opinion, it's all on the individual and their perception about life.
How aware they are about reality and on their take on reality. I think is important to know about it but also know when to be optimistic.

I believe there are many divorces because woman keep thinking about finding their prince charming, but there is no such a thing. or Many guys and also girls find love as a game, rather, they confuse love with lust or attraction And they don't give themselves the respect that they should give. They don't get to know someone that well, or rather, they don't realize that in every relationship there are highs and downs and when they experience the downs, they want the divorce. ( Though, every case has an exception)

So in my opinion, with each new generation respect and responsibility are getting lost. I can blame it on the lack of communication between the parents and the sons.

Though, I also know of cases were orphans were raised by the street and they turned out to be great citizens. My take on this is they were aware of their reality but also they never gave up.

Now days, kids live on video games and internet. and I think I'm getting out of topic.

On the other case, where they had a traumatic relationship. It's best to divorce. On those types of occasions, The ones that suffer the most are the kids.

I guess the rest of debate loving PnQers are in hibernation or preparing for their semester Finals next week. So I will try to fill in instead with some thoughts.
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I do get your line of discussion now Larry, human-to-human advice of how to face a tragic situation like the one above.
Being a family law attorney, you probably have faced this situation 1000 times over, so I believe you are the one more qualified on giving advice on these situations. But, placing myself in the intern's shoes here are some thoughts:

-- Victims of marital abuse, particularly women perhaps become too dependent on their spouses if they continue to take the abuse over years. They often lose the distinction of what is not right and what they believe is tolerable, and perhaps end up feeling inadequate over and over again, when told "you are no good ...etc" during the emotional arguments. The fact that the wife could endure repeated beatings/abuses and still feel that staying in the marriage is even a option, would be unthinkable for most of us. So, she needs a lot of support from extended family (grandparents and like), friends and the society/church/peer groups. Hopefully, she will find some real support from sympathizers and learn to eventually live independently using her education to gain employment and fulfill the role of a single parent.....a tough one always. If she is lucky and can go a bit beyond, she may find a more compassionate companion/spouse in future to share her burden and then the problems may be solved.

-- Re: Kids...doubt if they will miss their abusive dad much, and may not have any memories of the abuse by the time they grow in to teens. They are better off with a loving mom and supportive grandparents/relatives/friends...just my opinion, regardless of what the studies show. I think if the mother herself becomes neglectful or takes to alcohol, drugs or lands herself in another bad relationship, is when they could be potentially at risk. The best short term situation could be to have a grandparent (if available) move in with them or vice-versa for parenting help.

(Lesson for all young mothers to be from Larry's clients story - Please do not consider marrying/having kids before you finish schooling/college and try out how to be financially independent imagining yourself in a tough scenario like this).

Issues that arise time after time:

The victim takes the blame.
The kids remember selectively.
There are no win-win solutions.

Victim Guilt: Abusive relationships inevitably involve a situation in which the abused spouse, most often the wife, is psychologically abused as well as physically. In fact, this form of abuse is even more prevalent. The impact is that the victim believes that she "deserves" the punishment for the wrongs that she has done. Often she is predisposed toward this mindset by previous relationships, starting with abusive parents. She covers the abuse from the world and even her own kids because she is ashamed to have been the cause of it. Later the children reflect this blame onto her because she made daddy go away.

Selective Memory: Kids remember the love and nurturing they received from dad long after they forget witnessing his abuse of their mom. They tend to sanctify the father, either not accepting his faults or actively denying them. The blame I spoke of goes on mom. I have often dealt with moms, this week in fact, who tell me their young daughters actually say, "I hate you mom, you were mean to daddy." In the case at mind, this came from an incredibly lovable young 9 year old who saw her father destroy the apartment in rage.

Lose-lose: Most abused women are put into situations where they put up with the abuse - thereby carrying it on another generation through modeling behavior. The other choice is to get out, or at least accept his departure, but then raise the children fatherless with all the risks I described earlier.

I do not have a solution to eradicate the problem. Life in general is built around mirth and suffering. But that's the beauty of it.

In multiple cases, the children grow up being fed hatred for the missing parent. One partner decides to split with the children. And when asked by the children about the absent partner, in majority of the scenarios the parent will say the obvious that "your father/mother cheated, or walked out on us", etc etc. To clap, one hand isnt enough. You need a second. It is necessary for the children to not jump to conclusions before hearing stories from both the sides.

Women do blame themselves for the abuse, they believe they deserve it. Which is not true. They merely have grown accustomed to it. They've made a compromise. Perhaps they are tired of the drama. After being abused for a decade or two, no woman would still think she deserves it. They've been abused too much, physically and verbally. They have accepted such a condition of thriving. Is it not a form of depression?. .Changing their mentality is quite difficult, since one will be convincing such an individual to start over in life. To embed the sense of joy that accompanies freedom of choice and security.

And yes, it is acceptable to raise children without a father figure. It is better to be raised without a father, than a father that comes home drunk and channels his frustrations and failure upon his children and wife. A male figure like an uncle or grandfather can provide assistance where needed, or from time to time. Women are perfectly capable of doing everything that a man can.