Who is perfect, what is perfection??

This might inspire you::
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8umFV69fNg

it might not, it depends.

I'm perfectly imperfect in my own type of way

but I really like what they did. Everyone could be a model, in fact, many people are already models and they don't know it. So making a mannequin to show other people that, it was inspiring.

So good you think it is inspiring.
the thing that inspired me the most was she hugged her mannequin replica. Only she knew how beautiful she was.
two questions though:

First, could abnormal be beautiful or only tolerated?
Second, why the physical symmetries conquer the aesthetical grasp in our hearts predominantly? They could be empty shells or the shilled for an unsymmetrical soul.
So easily we can fall in love with a mask. Unsightly people have higher urges to put up much better masks than those who do not really need them, but they are compelled because we all are invited to the masquerade ball of life.

Could abnormal be beautiful or only tolerated?

In my opinion, both. At first it could be tolerated, but eventually it could be find beautiful. They say "beauty is in the eye of the beholder" but I also think "the heart can change the mind faster than the mind can change the heart." In other words, at first we see beauty in what we consider to be "the normal type of beauty," (physically usually) but once we spend time and get to know someone who is abnormal (per se), we get used to that person and we start seeing the beauty in them.

Second, why the physical symmetries conquers the aesthetical grasp in our hearts predominantly?

--- I think that it isn't our hearts that find the beauty at first, rather the mind. So due to it, we may spend more time getting to know someone with great symmetries and based on getting to know them we may or not like them.

Though, in our daily life, we are not used to seeing perfectly symmetrical figures...
that when we find something symmetrical we may consider it perfect and we fall in love with it. I mean even a "normal" person with "normal weight" and with all four of his limbs may not be entirely symmetrical. It may have a fatter foot, or one longer toe... one leg longer or shorter than the other, just like in the video. So we may think that whoever is the most symmetrical is closets to being the most beautiful. I guess we may think that having everything in the right place, balances that person and brings people the equilibrium that they seek for themselves.

yeah, I guess that's what happens... Though I heard that not even a circle is perfectly symmetrical, would that be true? and if you don't mind what are your views on those two questions?

---

Plus, What do you think about this link?

http://www.businessinsider.com/symmetrical-faces-2011-7

In my opinion beauty has no definitions or it has plenty more than we know of.

"why the physical symmetries conquers the aesthetical grasp in our hearts predominantly?"

Symmetry is a sign of health and we, humans look for it especially when we are trying to find a partner. Its build into our subconsciousness.. Asymmetrical features are a sign of underlying genetic problems.

" Its build into our subconsciousness.."

^^ I like how you carefully said the above. I guess humans look for symmetry specially for procreation purposes?

If you don't mind, what are your thoughts on the first question?

Does anyone else have any other opinions?

"I like how you carefully said the above. I guess humans look for symmetry specially for procreation purposes?"

You see, the sad part is that I have to be "careful" to say the logical! Every species need the best genetic mix to survive...
As for your question:"If you don't mind, what are your thoughts on the first question?" Symmetry has nothing to do with beauty, and the beauty. I'm talking about is the inner one, the most important one for me.. Appearance is always deceiving if you are looking for the Love of your Life... ~smiles~

" Symmetry has nothing to do with beauty, and the beauty I'm talking about is the inner one, the most important one for me"

--- believe it or not, between all my above rambling that's what I meant to say. Except that I do get confused, I thought Real meaning was speaking of symmetry in terms of Physical symmetry... and that people often consider beauty to be the body who is more symmetrical.... so as a result they leave behind the inner self and they may become shallow minded.

However, Real meaning also mentioned "They could be empty shells or the shilled for an unsymmetrical soul" <----- unsymmetrical SOUL

Is there symmetry in terms of inner self? Could we refer to the inner one as symmetry in a metaphorical way?

But then if we could, there wouldn't be anyone perfect not physically nor even in the inner self, because not even a circle is perfect.

I think I am obsess with that idea. Anywho, but I think I'm sort of getting it.

Another thing that puzzles me is what Real meaning mentioned:

"the thing that inspired me the most was [when] she hugged her mannequin replica. Only she knew how beautiful she was."

---- Why only until she hugged her replica did she see her beauty? Is there a mystery behind a mannequin? Is it that, she is no longer afraid of her body? or that she finally accepts herself as she is? or having a mannequin/ a replica of herself created the symmetry/( A mirror) she needed to see the beauty in herself? Why is it not easy to find the beauty in ourselves?

""" the sad part is that I have to be "careful" to say the logical""

--- There are also the erroneous type of logic... ( Logical fallacies ) so one must try to be careful even with the logic.

"I thought Real meaning was speaking of symmetry in terms of Physical symmetry..."

I think he was ( I wasn't) and most peeps do consider beauty to be the body who is more symmetrical, it is in our blood, genes to choose like that, to maintain our species to be strong and healthy. Look at the animal kingdom, you dont see a 3 legged lion doing a "horizontal limbo" with a lioness do you now? Then again you dont see lions going around raging wars at other lions either... You see, now Im getting frustrated but we need a new thread to talk about that..

"However, Real meaning also mentioned "They could be empty shells or the shilled for an unsymmetrical soul" <----- unsymmetrical SOUL"

^^^I would like to believe that souls dont have symmetry nor dimensions what so ever, like God they are infinite and everywhere if it makes any sense to you...

"the thing that inspired me the most was [when] she hugged her mannequin replica. Only she knew how beautiful she was."

Or maybe she just "felt" who she really was..?
Excepting who you really are is the first step to happiness to Beauty... ~smiles~ and after that is when the ~real journey~ begins...

""" the sad part is that I have to be "careful" to say the logical""

--- There are also the erroneous type of logic... ( Logical fallacies ) so one must try to be careful even with the logic.

Not in this case dear One!

Sorry dear Everlasting I was really busy to respond to your question

Dear "Deepest Essence"
The knot is you take the word symmetry very literally. What I meant was the symmetry in regard to science of aesthetical proportions, not functionality. In that sense an unsightly soul is also unsymmetrical: like people who do not understand the balance of behavioral and ethical proportions, Simple example: taking love but do not offering, wanting respect but not giving it ... Those who enjoy art and un- pretentious poetry are more symmetrical in their soul. Even though we can not measure behavioral and ethical and spiritual patterns of beauties with centimeters but there are the other tools to notice invisible harmonies. I thought these were already implied. I shouldn't be needing to explain these to a soul like you. Dear "Deepest Essence"~~smiles~~

everlasting you are the most enthusiastic soul in this place for the REAL MEANINGS. Actually what I mean you have shown the list aloofness in this generation of P&Q towards IT. And that and another reason has changed your poetical fate drastically. If you put yourself available to the REAL MEANINGS, REAL MEANINGS in turn make themselves available to you.
Your soul responds to the quintessential s and "quintessence" is a living things, therefore it is looking back at you. it looks back at you through the magic; in this case the magic is inspiration. You might think you are the thinker of your thoughts because the world seems this way from the eyes of an individual. But anytime that you see your heart and mind is tipsy of inspirational thought, think it this way: you have been worthy( I come back to this later) Promise
Your poetry is amazing now; it is nothing in compare with what it was before. Keep on being worthy, you might find your Neruda in you.

Rumi said: "legs of logic are wooden and wooden legs would wobble" ( open translation):
Philosopher try too hard to find out the things that a "seer- seeker" already knows.
The problem with the young enthusiastic scholars is the reason. You can not stop them in this stage because they need that to learn, but, it prevents them to peek into the realm or REAL MEANINGS.
Per a notion you have so many logical (wooden legged) questions that even in some of them you answer your own. haha talking of paradox!!

Imperfection is perfect in its own right because it has touched everything that existing, existed and will exist.
aging is perfect and constant.
death is perfect and never missed one.
changing is perfect and constant.

Haha you figured them all out!!

"What I meant was the symmetry in regard to science of aesthetical proportions, not functionality. In that sense an unsightly soul is also unsymmetrical:"

I dont believe a soul could ever be unsymmetrical! My mother used to say: "in an unbroken body is an unbroken soul.. "
And I always told her: There is no such a thing as an "unsightly soul" but its shell, our body..

"Imperfection is perfect in its own right because it has touched everything that existing, existed and will exist. "

That is just simply not true!!! First of all, when you have to use words like "in its own right" you defeating the purpose
of your own argument! Maybe your thoughts were trying to brush upon Human Rights? What I was trying to point out is that there are no I's and You's in Spiritual world, where our souls are from

"because it has touched everything that existing"

^^^ well that sounds very poetic yet it left my incomplete existence as a human shell, wonder about all the things I will never touched, felt because it has not touched everything, not have experienced much just a small fraction of this 4D reality...

Every form, not being the whole, must, of necessity, be imperfect; less than the whole, it cannot be identical with the whole, and being less than the whole and, therefore, imperfect by itself.

D.E. you have to mention to whom your answer is referring. I can not find anyone saying "on its own right" I know I didn't. So tell me what do you call the soul of Charles Manson, Child molesters, rapists, Jack the Ripper...?

I agree everything exist has the element of perfection in it and on the other hand everything that exist has the element of imperfection. So what? this has no bearing on our discussion . you are talking semantic here instead of meaning. Why?? I do not think you do not understand. I think you do it on purpose, but why? Anything that exist is exempt from the model of perfection otherwise it would not fit in the confine of time sequence: "TIME is the distance of perfection and perfection lost"~~ ddavidd~~
This goes for you too Hellon, You both are mistaking in Opposite direction of each other:
Nothing is whole, everything is relatively perfect in one side and relatively imperfect, in the other side of this equation.

Edited
EL. about that link. Beauty cannot be only summarized to the dimensional proportions in symmetry, there so many other symmetrical variations also; such as: spectral symmetry, symmetrical spectrums, symmetrical shads, symmetrical mind. These all affect the aura of beauty.
The nature of beauty is the subject of so many discussions in Philosophy. It is amongst the secondary qualities because like colour and proportion, is the object of senses (beauty is in the eyes of beholder). But lots of philosopher (mostly materialist) think even the secondary qualities, amongst the primary, lives on their own, independent to the mind and our perceptions.
Gorge Berkeley on the other hand thinks neither of those qualities live on their own, away from our perceptions, or the one of divinity. (sorry I did not want to go to detail , but you asked)

Nothing is whole, everything is relatively perfect in one side and relatively imperfect, in the other side of this equation

^^^

I think I just said that...didn't I?

Did you?? sorry I did not understand well ( over my head) :( ):

Thank you RM

"D.E. you have to mention to whom your answer is referring. I can not find anyone saying "on its own right" I know I didn't. So tell me what do you call the soul of Charles Manson, Child molesters, rapists, Jack the Ripper...?"

I knew that you will ask me of this dear RM..
I believe with all my heart that a child is born pure,
innocent!!! You don't believe me? Read the quotes of
Nelson Mandela...

So logic dictates that if your son or mine becomes
a serial murder, there must have been a dramatic event in his life that made him become broken like that.. So your question must be answered by a question:
If you corrupt an individual being will his/her soul
be corrupted as well?

Let me say this though: I believe we humans can
corrupt anything we want to but the soul..

"Every form, not being the whole, must, of necessity, be imperfect; less than the whole, it cannot be identical with the whole, and being less than the whole and, therefore, imperfect by itself."

^^Where did you read that???

Edit : on second thought...

Never mind.

^^Where did you read that???

^^^

Probably the same place you get your stuff from????

If we're talking about people, I think perfection can only come about once a person accepts and loves their inherent imperfections as part of their being (except for, of course, imperfections that may lead to the harm of others around them).

No one is perfect. But I agree. We have to learn to accept ourselves before anything. In Buddhism once a person reaches enlightenment that is true perfection in that religion.