I just lost faith in humanity

Moaz al-Kassassebeh, the Jordan hostage pilot, was burnt alive yesterday by ISIS. I watched the video and I almost threw up. I couldn't sleep last night. I don't think I've ever been more disgusted and sick and terrified. What's even more horrifying is that some people on Facebook are HAPPY about this ugly crime. Wtf is wrong with people!?? I can't believe that these criminals live with us, that they're a few kilometers away from us.

Syrians began to pray to die in an easy, quick way.
4 years of war, of death and hunger and torture, and nothing has been done to stop these heartless savages.
I don't know why I'm posting here but I badly needed to say something.

You know what's more disgusting Noura ? How the Non-Islamic state reveals that the video is fabricated and then claims that it's not and then others start analyzing the edits and the graphics and the reaction of the victim to come to a conclusion by the time his parents are suffering with all this crap.

This has been happening with most of the recent victims; but whether this has happened or not, these groups have the most inhuman, deadly, disgusting thoughts ever. I have no idea what they're made of, but they're definitely not made of real flesh and blood.

ISIS is a true enemy.

As Glenn Beck just posted an hour ago: "Jews, gentiles, straight, gay, black, white, western, eastern, atheist, Christian or Muslim -- it is time you recognize what you are up against, look it square in the eye and call it by its name: evil and a plague on mankind."

ISIS is capitalizing on hatred and radical dissension. It uses the pent up rage of individuals and directs each adherent against "the enemy" without distinction that the enemy is all of us.

Al-Azhar Sheikh: Killers of the pilot should be crucified or have their limbs amputated.
Exactly. That's what we need. More hatred.

And Rania, oh god, I had to listen to a woman saying that crap today for half an hour. It's as if ISIS hasn't done anything this cruel before.
I'll never forget the massacre of Daraa one year ago, and the victims who were locked in ovens. Some of them were children.
Their hideous crimes are countless.

After death we are only going to go to heaven because we are already living in hell....

Egypt's top Muslim authority, the 1,000 year old Al-Azhar university revered by Sunni Muslims around the world, issued a statement expressing "deep anger over the lowly terrorist act" by what it called a "Satanic, terrorist" group.

I was under the delusion that uncivilized acts of terror would be by now fading away not many years ago ,but the Satanic rituals that have perverted religion for centuries seem to bringing back tortured mutilations under the guise of pleasing a merciful God . I am sickened by this

This absolutely breaks my heart and makes me angry. Angry for this mans family, angry for the division these people are creating, angry for Muslims as it gives them a bad light to some people. I'm angry that some people skew the idea of God into such a demonic way (we all know it's the enemy anyhow). I just keep steady in prayer because that's truly the only thing I can do. I don't know how I can help, but prayer is my hope.

My heart hurts for this world. We're all broken people, and it's so hard to live on this earth sometimes.

Who funds ISIS? What is their ultimate goal?

I am guessing they want to rule the world

It is as if motivated by the blood red moons & Nostradamus
http://youtu.be/gLoS8mTe-BQ

I somehow find it cynical to believe that they do have religious beliefs, unless we are speaking of the general definition of the word religion which goes back to merely in how THEY see this world's system. They are people of no faith, they have obsessions and hallucinations. Also they murder people and kill them for laws and restrictions that they themselves, do break everyday. They're the real meaning of hypocrisy.

On a different note, I would like to add to what Senyru has said, despite how much they've already seized in Iraq; they did not start that strong you know. Before their evil has unleashed and reached and rooted almost everywhere and in every country these were only extremists and unstable groups funded and supported before they became that independent, by ? let me leave the answer for everyone to reach according to his own conclusion. The thing is that today each government is trying to blindly do compromises, UN negotiations, world conflict conferences to find a way to cease this before every country in East and West is finished by them, by the time they are mascaraing people for the silliest reasons in the name of an imagery God and un-existing messengers, a brutality of their own.

They are no longer really under control. And we will be hearing more and more about them and their crimes. I can see Europe and Syria and other Arab countries in further bloodshed-crisis, In Lebanon we have already had a huge portion from their curse in 2014 from countless explosions that only got limited by high security restrictions and checkpoints. I don't think any part in the world is going to be safe to be honest anytime soon.

I followed the link of Senyru and read through the article and then read this:
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/16/terrifying-rise-of-isis-iraq-executions

Also the link of Michael was interesting, when you click through on several other clips, you ultimately get to hear the Pope of Rome is the antichrist... food for thought...

I do NOT believe God would ever condone one of his children taking the life of any of his other children, for whatever reason there might be. Wipe out hate, yes, wipe out prejudice, wipe out this notion of 'foreign' people being the so called 'enemy', but never, ever kill any of His creations. God is love and only with love we can overcome this darkness we are in. I do not believe in 'bad' people, but do know some of us are lead astray. It is hard to remember that those who are out to dominate and kill are also His children, but they are. They do not know what they do, as they live in a darkness we cannot even imagine and they are motivated by hate for an enemy that exists only in their imagination.

But what doesn't make any sense is that muslims around the world would get hurt and provoked by a few cartoons about their prophet which represent someone's opinion and should be respected or at least ignored, but would not bat an eye when an ugly crime like this is committed in the name of their religion. I mean, this crime is much more offensive to Islam than Charlie Hebdo's cartoons, the cartoons that drove muslims crazy, but I still haven't seen them gathering for demonstrations to condemn ISIS brutality.

I don't mean to disrespect anyone here, but what is cynical? I've read the Quraan and learnt it by heart, and the words "kill, cut, invade" are repeated in every verse. Why do muslims keep defending their religion and claim that these terrorists don't represent them when their holy book is the cause and motivation of all these murders?

Even before the war in Syria, people would get executed if they dare say their opinion, women are always oppressed, children are taught to hate, to be blind followers, and this religion is the reason, and we still wonder how ISIS was created?
It's the result of years of ignorance and prejudice.

"Also the link of Michael was interesting, when you click through on several other clips, you ultimately get to hear the Pope of Rome is the antichrist... food for thought..."

I was implying that the leader of ISIS is not mentally stable and it is said that Hitler and even his enemies were aware of the quatrains of Nostradamus and used them for propaganda purposes

http://youtu.be/nhcGZetOgnY

http://newprophecy.weebly.com/nostradamus-and-the-new-prophecy-almanacs-blog-and-media-interactive1/al-baghdadi-al-bigdaddy-declares-caliphate-and-himself-as-emir

Ingrid you've made a good point, and Michael ya I dont think theyre stable either but still I cant say theyre all unaware of what theyre doing, theyre not a group of 50 or 100, theyre seriously spread. But from a very honest point of you I'd say the following,

No person full of faith would believe that a religion teaches you to do that, those who are in power do know the whole falsehood and are aware of everything and every detail, or else an X religion and its rituals would be entirely banned from being practiced on any spot in their country.

We've already spoke about something almost close to this subject but about priorities in general, in my club, and I stated my opinion regarding religion and societies.

I said that religion doesn't shape out a certain society, it's the other way around. It is the rules and the traditions and the do and don't in a certain area that actually manipulates what their people derive from a certain religion.

Whether we are going to accept it or not, it is the environment that shapes out how people practice religion. Every country has its own traditions and restrictions, taking Islam for example, whether Islam suggests a certain freedom or right, those people would not practice their full rights if certain traditions are not allowed in their environment.

I would never be in a place to defend Islam, why would I? just because I'm a Muslim doesn't mean I have to defend the wrong doings of other people who come from entirely different environments, or what they do in the name of God or in the name of any Prophet whether it was Muhammad or Jesus or whomever. God is not mine, nor theirs. We don't have our own God, and Christians their own and humanists their own. For those who believe it's really just one God. We are no different.

So I really don't think people are that shallow minded to believe that God has asked these people to kill their fellow Muslims or sisters from other religious systems for smoking in the street (it happened) or for any sillier other reason (happening everyday). God has no messengers today and has no partners on earth and no one has the right to take anyone's life for whatever reasons. He doesn't have a court on earth with "deputies" of his own. It is called a crime and ANY religion, from any part of the world condemns crime in all its shapes.

So just to finish my main point, we all have to look back on the origin of these groups, and where their individuals came from; I am not saying all of them, but most of them come from unopen environments, what they preach and regard to Islam is something they've derived from their own life and their own beliefs not from the teachings of Islam.

Especially in Saudi Arabia and Syria, 95 % of Saudi's environment, and majorly the far villages of Syria where poverty and old traditions rule; closed up mediums overwhelming these people, they practice a certain life style and have a lot of restrictions that they really do not have to stick or abide by, simply by being simply Muslims, but their environment shapes out their lives by what is allowed and what is not allowed, what is accepted and what is not accepted, not their religion, but their environment's system.

From women driving cars, to women's education, to women's black outfits to women's rights, to what men are supposed to be like and how women are expected to be, etc etc It is very important to study and examine closely the difference between the environmental system of societies and the religions in societies. It is a huge difference, as which to be the real issue here.

In Lebanon being a country of variety and not an Islamic country, but a country of countless religions, all those who were marked as extremists come from the poor and neglected parts of the country, from parts where everything is a taboo, parts poorer than the rest of the country, just like in any country there are areas neglected by the government big way; and how the people there live and what kind of life-style they have is shapped by their surrounding ambience, and has nothing to do with what religion they follow. And sometimes these close minded people whom were not blessed by being educated enough to be aware enough, find no other option other than joining such groups, you'd be surprised to read further on how much ISIS is paying for every single man and woman recruited; it's over the internet, you'd want to read.

This is where the Governments would want to start, the neglected parts of every city, the poor areas, the general environment, the awareness campaigns on human rights. The difference between Religion and Environment, the power and limit of religion and environment. The shape ruling their environments. I said the word environment like a 100 time, but that is a very important point to take into consideration. (In my humble opinion)

I'm sorry to say this noura but if what you claim to say about reading the Quran is ture.
Then i fail to make sense of what's in your head
Cause i know for a fact that you're a cleaver girl.
The quran in itself is unique. Much more unique then it's equals of other religions in the way it's recited. It's poetry of the finest level, and i really feel blessed that i understand and fluently speak Arabic to fully fathom what's been said in it.
The fact that all you've gathered from reading it whole are words like kill and conquer etc. Can only mean that you've read it to condemn it, if you've read it at all. Knowing that all 3 of the sacred books have verses that list these actions either as punishments or as tales of the past.

Now about the pilot, which happens to be my countrymen of nationality, and citizen of the same city. The upmost respect
And admiration. And gratitude for the way he showed strength in his last stand, embarrsing those who've lead a path that have went astray. By not fearing his fate. And raising both hands to the sky while he met such a gruesome death. But mouad is only a shellow of an image of what's happening and being portrayed in the rest of the region.
The children of Syria have had the same fates and even much worse. Not to mention everywhere else.
My problem lies in the fact that I've watched the video while eating a snack
Only feeling bad for a moment then carrying out with my normal day to day activity.
Us as a nation have become dehumanised. Even worse
Desensitised from feelings.
In the west if they find a dog that's homless on top of a tree
They're willing to send air support to ensure its safety
But here. Blood is just irrelevant

Rania you're at fault here
You're generalising and that's never good.
First, I'm a resident of Saudi Arabia and while I understand all of what you say regarding the matter you're at a contradiction whereas only a small fraction of those i dear not to say their names consist of Saudis to begin with.
These cowards and murderers consist mainly of people from north Africa. Just watch some of their videos. And other part of the world.
Now what i fail to make sense of is what's their purpose.
The enemy lies to the west of Syria and south west of Iraq.
What's been done in that regard? Nothing
Why haven't isis take any kind of stand to the presence of israel? To understand their idolgy and what I made of it.
It mainly has to do with the funding of these groups.
If they can afford millions of dollars to create Hollywood material documentation and short movies then it scares me as to what budget they have.
So to fully understand these crooks snd hypocrites
You need to ask this question.
Whose funding it? And what purpose do these criminals serve?

What i made of it is divide and conquer.

In every step of the way if you divide then conquer a nation.
Then that nation will do all the work you as a mastermind want done while you're sitting behind you're office.
The purpose of the creation and funding of ISIL is clear.

Why is there a mad dog in our house killing ruthlessly at our backyards anything that disagrees with its idolgy when Palestine is only a few kilometers away.

You coorlate the dots here nani
And you'll get a much clearer picture.

Islam is beautiful. It hurts my hurt to its image being shattered this way only cause it serves someones agenda

Rab,
Your conspiracy theory may or may not have merit, but it must not divert attention from one salient fact: ISIS must be wiped out and to do so requires a combined effort.

Larry my friend
Spot on
Trust me nothing would feel better than to wipe those who rape murder snd pillage in the name of my religion.
But i take you for a wise man.
And what has money done to us over the years? It only buys wars it never buys peace.

Oh Bonbbo3a 1st of all I miss you, 2nd ya I agree with you, wasn't trying to generalize, I think we have a little misunderstanding, when I spoke of Saudi Arabia and the poor villages of Syria and Lebanon, I was regarding to the difference between Religion and Environments, I know you live there and since you do live in KSA, we both know that Saudi Arabia is a preservative country isn't it ? And residents there being men or women stick to the traditions there even if Islam doesn't oblige them with certain things; even if it is an Islamic country, the environment there is influenced majorly (saying majorly not completely) by what is accepted and not accepted for the Saudis as set by their culture not by Islam itself. Just like in any diff. country.

It was only an example of how environments shape out the lives of people, to say that we can't mix between religion and environmental systems, even if these people are killing in the name of Islam we have to see where did these individuals come from, especially the people they recruit from the poor and neglected parts of the world, also majorly not speaking of every single man in their groups. Something which you've just highlighted as well in your post. Hope I cleared what I was trying to say.

And you've mentioned a very important point, why would they fight Israel ? Israel has announced more than once that they have no problems with these groups and that they are on their side; they are welcoming them in their hospitals too right from Syria.
I wonder who's funding them no ?

Thanks for bringing up the technology they've acquired too.

Just my 2 cents, wanted to clear what I tried to say in my earlier magazine-post. Completely agree with you, both.

Trust me nothing would feel better than to wipe those who rape murder snd pillage in the name of my religion.
^^^
Completely agree to this...
but then, sometimes murders are committed
for self defence...a murder is not always a murder although it is stated such...it can be self defence

"In every step of the way if you divide then conquer a nation.
Then that nation will do all the work you as a mastermind want done while you're sitting behind you're office.
The purpose of the creation and funding of ISIL is clear."

Exactly, and they've found religion is the best way to divide us, because it's our weakness.

Rab, I was raised by a muslim family, surrounded by muslim friends and neighbors. I was taught in school every letter of the holy book, and every hadith, and every story. But then I turned 16 and learnt some science and couldn't believe how much I had been brainwashed.

Look at every Islamic nation, at the ignorance and underdevelopment and violence.
In Saudi Arabia where you currently live, Raif al-Badawi has been sentenced to 10 years just for blogging. Women are covered in black, head to toe. Thieves get their hands cut. And these are not traditions, they're following the Quran.

Edit: And poetry of the finest level!? Um, nope.

These are definitely traditions, I haven't seen Quran verses about blogging! Neither about women in black, nor about women driving cars. I am Muslim as well, and I was raised by a Muslim family, I was not brainwashed though.

Isn't there a verse that says cut the hands of a thief!? Cut the head of a murderer? Stone the prostitute? A verse that says a man can hit his wife? That a woman should veil herself? That she is a shame!?

Not about blogging, because it was written long ago, but a disbeliever should be stoned to death according to Quran. And Raif al-Badawi was a liberal activist. Hence he's behind the bars.

Edit:

Did the Quran you've read letter by letter really say that those who do not believe should be stoned to death ?

Look I will not explain or elaborate on the Quran or Islam in this thread or in another, as I stated earlier, I don't think I stand guilty for the wrongs of others or their misinterpretations and misconceptions "as a muslim" And I am definitely not to preach or teach the Quraan, those who seek to know, will find answers by looking, and seems you'v found your own answers, and that's great and your full right as a human being.

But I'll just say that the Quraan stresses on the rights of peaceful disbelievers and on treating them equally as we treat believers.

I will quote :

"Allah has ordained us to use all our means and methods in a way that turns our enemies into our friends, instead of turning friends or ordinary people into our enemies.

Allah, the Most Exalted, says: "Allah does not forbid you from treating kindly those who have not made war against you on account of (your) religion - those who did not declare war on you just because you are Muslims while they are not, but rather they accepted the religious difference between you and them in an objective and peaceful manner - and have not driven you forth from your homes - meaning that they did not plan, through their political and military power, to drive you out of your homes and displace you from your land, but rather they were peaceful and coexisted with you in one homeland or neighboring homelands, just as one peaceful person coexists with another - that you show them kindness - for kindness reaches out to all the human relations that are based on cooperation, communication, and giving".

"And deal with them justly - that is, every person ought to be given his right; thus, you ought to treat them in a just manner for if they have a certain right on you, then you should not deprive them of this right - surely Allah loves the doers of justice" (60:08)."

"We ought to be aware of this issue in order to reveal the bright image of Islam, for Islam is the religion of justice. Islam is equally just toward the disbeliever and believer, the enemy and friend, and the close ones and distant ones. Therefore, man ought to treat all people justly and not to oppress anyone, for a tradition of the infallible pure holds (a.s.) reports: "Allah enjoined one of His prophets living in a country under the rule of a tyrant: "To go to this tyrant and tell him that I did not make use of you to shed the blood (of the people) and gather wealth. I made use of you to soothe the cries of the wronged, because you should not neglect their plight even if they were disbelievers - even if they were disbelievers, I will avenge their right from their oppressors"."

---
I'd have days to elaborate on this topic, so this will be my last cents on Islam and whether it is an evil religion or not, that's really not why I posted here. You are one of millions who do not believe in Islam and its peacefulness,
and I am one of other millions who do believe in it. Both of us having our own backgrounds and own facts of which we are convinced with, good for us! That is the freedom of choice.

Listen. Religion is a deep ocean, and a vast sea, the fact that you, rania and I all come from different opposing sects could tell you that.
I ain't saying you're mislead, and i ain't suggesting it either. But the fact of you only focusing on negatives while overseeing everything that is beautiful about it kind of suggests that you're looking the other way. I Don't come from a conservative or a religious family either. And I surely don't have the background to defend it either. But that doesn't mean that i have to hate it, there's good and bad in every religion indeed, but you're strucking me as someone with a magnifier only focusing on words like death, stone, kill. And while you're entitled to an opinion i don't see the necessity of having to spoofeed your opinion to others. Espically on a website that is very diverse in ethnicity.
What picture is it that you're trying to portray?
Are we all savages with no conious just cause we believe in a book that's 1400 years old?
Excuse me but the hell with that.
I'm sorry you had to go through with what you went through at such a young and small age, but dear expand your horizon
Not all your 10 fingers alike.

And on you're free time. Go read suret al Rahman.
I enjoy the look on anyone's face who happens to not share my religious point of views when they realise that what scientists are just discovering today with high technology cost have been there on ink sitting on a book that's 1400 years old. Whereas the likes of you call it primative and outdated.

And about the french journalist.
It's never ok to ridcule someone's faith,
You don't see us ridculing anyone's faith or misfortunes such as the Holocaust.
And if there is. Then these people don't represent us either.

On the subject of women here,
I don't see anyone complaining ever here.
26 years of age all spent in saudi and i haven't seen a single woman complain here. So why should you? When you're a thousand miles away.
Hell, a driver that does as he commands and a credit card that is limitless payed by your spouse or your legal guardian.
Sometimes i wish i was a woman here too.
It's their country. They get to apply whatever rules they want.
And if you're not comfortable with it then the door that got you here can easily get you out.
They don't seek your presence and neither do they need it.

Haha, see how we're underdeveloped? A limitless credit card and a driver? Is that the goal Saudi women have in their lives? And you're talking about the rich, what about the poor?
How could a woman complain there? She'll have her tongue plucked outta her mouth. I wouldn't dare.
How about the woman who once upon a time drove a car in Saudi Arabia and was thrown in jail and then women gathered in a demonstration and it was soon quashed, and the victim was forgotten...?

Rabi3, I hope you understand that I'm not being emotional here and I'm not saying all that just because I'm going through difficulties. If this war did anything to me, it made me fearless to speak my mind and made me think with more objectivity, it made void of any emotions.

EDIT.

Rab,
Co-option of upper class women with material goods and apparent freedom masks the enslavement that actually exists for all women who are unable to speak out or who do so at their peril.

We have women on this list who are anonymous for the very reason that if their families knew how outspoken they are on here would face serious repercussions.

I know you speak rashly and that given time to think you would not make such statements.

Again, the true issue here is the dissolution of ISIS regardless of who may or may not be backing them.

Agreed Larry!

Another hostage death confirmed by ISIS. Thankful this one wasn't plastered all over the internet.

I don't know that I've ever been more heartbroken over world events than what is happening right now. I know I personally live in a little bubble... a small, rural town in Oregon. We don't have murders in this town - it's a big deal when a home gets broken into. We have a drug problem but it doesn't amount to more than petty theft. To see the realities of this world just overwhelms my heart.

Regardless, the video is definitely edited.
You just can't burn to death and suddenly collapse without any resistance.

ISIS said theyve shot him with high levels of drugs and that's why he did not resist even before he was inside the bars/cage, and that's why although burning he wasn't aware of what was going on. They said, they did so for the sake of filming the whole thing, I also had doubts, very strong ones about the video, but the King of Jordan Abullah has already killed the prisoner they killed him for, she was killed instantly and also they started their air strikes on ISIS.

So what would they gain ? I don't know, everything being said on the media is convincing and that's really painful. No body knows anything, we just assume and analyze.

Supposedly 60 nations are at war against ISIS.

"The quran in itself is unique. Much more unique then it's equals of other religions in the way it's recited. It's poetry of the finest level, and i really feel blessed that i understand and fluently speak Arabic to fully fathom what's been said in it."

Is that so? When was the Quran written?? 632 CE??
Judaism claims a historical continuity spanning more than 3,000 years... Approximately 75% of the Tenach (Old Testament) is poetry. Have any of you read it in Hebrew??? Do I need to go any farther...
I am trying to believe that ISIS and the Quran has very little in common but I hate to lie to myself...

By the way... Who wrote the Quran?

The following is according to our own beliefs and shall not and are not enforced unto anyone, but as a reply to the question, I thought to share the following:

Quran, in Arabic, could only have been written by ONE of 3 possible sources:

1. the Arabs

2. Mohammad (peace be upon him)

3. God (Allah)

(NOTE: The first part is not meant to be a rigorous proof. It is something to ponder upon. However, the second part, about Mohammad [pbuh] wrote it' contains more extensive proof.)

Besides the above mentioned sources, Quran couldn't possibly have been written by ANYONE else.

No other source is possible, because Quran is written in pure, rich, and poetic Arabic, which was not known to anyone other than the above mentioned sources, at that time. The Arabic language was at its peak in expression, richness, vocabulary, artistic, and poetic value during the time the Quran was being revealed. Anyone speaking the classical Arabic ( the Arabic of Quran at the time it was revealed) would argue that a non-Arab entity couldn't possibly have written such an extensive and brilliant piece of literature in the Arabic language. Quran could only have been written by an Arabic speaking entity. An entity, who's knowledge, style, vocabulary, grammar, and way of expression was so powerful that it impacted the entire Arabian peninsula, the east, the west, and continues to impact people all over the globe today!

At no other time, in the history of Arabic language, had it ever achieved its peak in expression, literature, and development, than the time of Arabia during the 6th Century, the time when Quran was being revealed. At no other time in the history of Arabic language had the language ever achieved its highest potential than the time of Arabia during the 6th Century, the time when Quran was being revealed. The language reached its peak in richness, artistic value, and poetry, during that time. With the Arabic language at its peak, and the best of Arabic writers, poets present in Arabia, it is impossible that a non-Arabic speaking entity would write a book like Quran and have such a dynamite impact on the Arabs!

So only an Arabic speaking entity could have write Quran. With that in mind, we're left with three choies:

1 - the Arabs wrote it

2 - Mohammad (pbuh) wrote it

3 - Allah (swt) wrote it

Lets examine the three choces one by one.

(1) Arabs Wrote it?

What Quran teaches goes DIRECTLY against the pagan Arab culture, religion, and gods, that existed before the Quran was revealed. Quran condemns idol worshipping, but the Arabs, loved their idol gods, and worshipped them regularly. Quran raised the status of women; the Arabs treated women next to animals. The Arabs would never write something that goes against their most important belief of idol worshipping. Quran goes against most of the social habbits (such as backbiting, slandering, name calling, etc) which the Arabs were heavily indulged into. For example, the Arabs would call insulting nicknames such as Abu Jahal (the father of ignorance). Quran condemns and prohibits taking interest on money, whereas, the Arabs freely levied heavy interest rates in loans and businesses. Quran condemns and prohibits Alcohol drinking, whereas, the Arabs consumed alcohol freely. The Quran condemns and prohibits gambling, whereas, the Arabs were some of the worst gamblers. The Arabs would never write something so comprehensively against just about all of their customs and culture and religious beliefs, as the Quran is.

During the time of the Holy Prophet (pbuh), the Arabs would indulge in all the social habbits that the Quran condemns and prohibits. How can Arabs then write something that would negate their entire society's norms and ideologies?

Did a group of Arabs or an individual Arab write Quran? Perhaps a rebel Arab beduoin, or a society's misfit, or someone with different ideals and norms decided one day to write Quran? The answer to those questions are also 'no'. Because, if we read Quran, we notice that there is no author! No individual has his/her name written on the cover of Quran! Anytime an individual writes a book, he/she writes his/her name on the cover. The author's name always appears on his/her book, and there is always an author who is credited for writing that book. No one in the history of the world has EVER claimed to have written the Quran, nor anyone's name ever appeared in front of the Quran as bein the 'author'. This is the only book in the world without an author. No one in the world has ever been accused of writing the Holy Quran, except the Prophet Mohammad (peace be upon him), by non-muslims.

Quran has no author, and no group or individual in Arabia ever claimed to have written it, nor any group or an indvidual recited, taught, and explained Quran except the Prophet Mohammad (pbuh) and his followers. The Prophet Mohammad (peace be upon him) was the only Arabian who first practiced, explained, and preached Quran (as revealed to him ), and ended up making a lot of Arab tribes enemies. Any historian, Muslim or non-Muslim would argue that the only possible source of Quran can be the Prophet Mohammad (pbuh), the man responsible to recite it, teach it, and expalin it to the people of Arabia. In fact, many historians today still think that only Mohammad (pbuh) could possibly have written it.

This leads one to conclude that the Prophet (pbuh) must have written it!

(2) Mohammad (pbuh) wrote it?

First, he was illiterate !! How can an illiterate person come up with such a rich, poetic, intellectual, and inspiring text that it rocked the entire Arabia?

Mohammad (pbuh) never went to school! No one taught him. He had no teacher of any kind in any subjects. How can he have the knowledge of all the science, astronomy, oceanography, etc that is contained in the Quran? (For example, the mention of ocean currents, stars, earth, moon, sun and their fixed paths in Soorah Rahman; and many other scientific statements that are found in Quran, that I cannot state in this short article)

When Quran was revealed, the Arabic language was at its peak in richness, poetic value, literature, etc. Quran came and challenged the best literature in Arabic, the best poetry in Arabic of the time. Mohammad (pbuh) being illiterate couldnt possibly have come up with something so immaculate that it even exceded the best of poetry, and literature in Arabic at the time of the language's PEAK development. Arabic language had never been so rich in expression, poetic value, vocabulary, and variety in literature, as it was in the time of Quran. At a time like this, Quran came and exceeded the best of Arabic in all aspects of the language: poetry, literature, expression, etc. Any classical Arabic speaker would appreciate the unbeatten, unchallenged, and unmatched beauty of the language of Quran.

An illiterate man is simply not capable of writing such a book.

Mohammad (pbuh) had no reason to come up with something like Quran, and cause the entire society of Arabia to become his enemy. Why would he do something like that? Why would he write something going against almost all of the norms of the society, and lose his family, relatives, friends, and other loved ones, and not to mention all the wealth he lost

Quran was revealed over a period of 23 years! A very long time! Is it possible for someone to maintain the same exact style of Arabic speech , as demonstrated in Quran, for over 23 years?

Also, what the prophet Mohammad (saaw) used to say is recorded in what we call his hadeeth (sunnah). If we look at the Arabic style of the hadeeth, and compare it with the style of Quran, we can clearly see that they are clearly DIFFERENT, and DISTINGUISHABLE Arabic styles. The prophet (saaw) spoke in public. It does not make sense that a man has two UNIQUE, Distinguishable, and completely different styles of speech in public. Yet another reason why Mohammad (saaw) couldn't possibly have written Quran.

Quran was revealed over a period of 23 years ! A very long time! Is it possible for someone to maintain the same exact style of Arabic speech , as demonstrated in Quran over 23 years?

Here's what our famous Muslim Scholar, Ahmad Deedat said:

WAS QURAN WRITTEN OR INSPIRED?

"Behold! The angels said: "O Mary! God has chosen you and purified you - Chosen you above the women of all nations." Qur'an-3:42

THE SOURCE OF HIS MESSAGE

"Chosen you above the women of all nations." Such an honour is not to be found given to Mary even in the Christian Bible!

Knowing full-well, and believing as we do, that the whole Quran is the veritable Word of God, we will nevertheless agree, for the sake of argument, with the enemies of Muhammed (pbuh) for a moment, that he wrote it. We can now expect some cooperation from the unbeliever.

Ask him, "Have you any qualms in agreeing that Muhammed (pbuh) was an Arab?" Only an opinionated fool will hesitate to agree. In that case there is no sense in pursuing any discussion. Cut short the talk. Close the book!

With the man of reason, we proceed. "That this Arab, in the first instance, was addressing other Arabs. He was not talking to Indian Muslims, Chinese Muslims, or Nigerian Muslims. He was addressing his own people - the Arabs. Whether they agreed with him or not, he told them in the most sublime form - words that were seared into the hearts and minds of his listeners that Mary the mother of Jesus -A JEWESS- was chosen above the women of all nations. Not his own mother, nor his wife nor his daughter, nor any other Arab woman, but a Jewess! Can one explain this? Because to everyone his own mother or wife, or daughter would come before other women.

Why would the Prophet of Islam honour a woman from his opposition! and a Jewess at that! belonging to a race which had been looking down upon his people for three thousand years? Just as they still look down upon their Arab brethren today.

SARAH AND HAGAR

The Jews get their cock-eyed racism from their Holy Bible, where they are told their father, Abraham, had two wives -Sarah and Hagar. They say that they are the children of Abraham through Sarah, his legitimate wife; that their Arab brethren have descended through Hagar, a "bondwoman", and that as such, the Arabs are inferior breed.

Will anyone please explain the anomaly as to why Muhammed (pbuh) (if he is the author) chose this Jewess for such honour? The answer is simple - HE HAD NO CHOICE - he had no right to speak of his own desire. "IT IS NO LESS THAN AN INSPIRATION SENT DOWN TO HIM." (Qur'an, 53:4).

SURA MARYAM

There is a Chapter in the Holy Quran, named Sura Maryam "Chapter Mary" (XIX) named in honour of Mary, the mother of Jesus Christ (pbuh); again, such an honour is not to be found given to Mary in the Christian Bible. Out of the 66 books of the Protestants and 73 of the Roman Catholics, not one is named after Mary or her son. You will find books named after Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Peter, Paul and two score more names, but not a single one is that of Jesus or Mary!

If Muhammed (pbuh) was the author of the Holy Quran, then he would not have failed to include in it with MARYAM, the mother of Jesus, his own mother - AMINA, his dear wife - KHADIJA, or his beloved daughter - FATIMA. But No! No! this can never be. The Quran is not his handiwork!

Another Muslim writes:
From: Abu Abdullah;
Subject: Re: Mohammad Wrote the Quran? [KORAN]
Date: Sat, 05 Aug 95 12:44:14 EDT

I was reading about the charge that the prophet, Mohammed (pbuh), has written the Quran himself. Before you go any further in reading this post, please ask yourself whether you are a honest truth seeker or just another argumentative person, if the former, continue, otherwise, save your time and jump to the next post.

Islam is based on faith that is supported by a number of strong miracles such as knowing what events to take place ahead of time or coming up with supernatural deeds in front of people. The holy Quran has these signs and much more. First, The holy Quran predicted many events to take place ahead of the time of the revelation of that verse; for example, predicting the destruction of Persian empire at a time where the later had a monumental victory over Rome. If the prophet, as some people claim, has written the Quran, then he would have put his future in real jeopardy (50% chance) since neither satellite photos nor on-ground intelligence personnel were available to him at the revelation time. Further, numerous details about many natural phenomena were detailed in the Quran and, until recently, they were proven by experts to be amazingly accurate. For example of the physical development of the fetus inside the womb along with timing given by many verses matches exactly what leading authorities in Embryology are claiming to be recent discoveries. Moreover, verses that gives descriptions about the creation of the universe and the function of mountains in balancing earth and many other descriptions/explanations are available to be read and to be understood. If the prophet was the author, wouldn't he be prone to make weak inferences similar to those who claim that earth is square and whoever says otherwise should be killed?

The prophet also has demonstrated many supernatural miracles not by his own power, but by the power of the creator. He went to Jerasalem back in one night and gave a detailed description of the carnival that was traveling on that route and also specific accedint happend to them at that noght (in those days, it takes a month or so for a round-trip). In another ocasion, he provided water for an entire army from a small plate between his hands. There are many other miracles that require serious truth seeker to read about and to think about it.

From the above, it reasonable to conclude that the Quran is not the PROPHET CREATION. HE HAD NO WAY TO PREDICT ALL THESE EVENTS AND TO BE RIGHT ALL THE TIME, ESPECIALLY WHEN KNOWING THAT THE PROPHET HIMSELFE WAS ILLITERATE!

Embryology and Life Sciences in Quran
"The Developing Human. Clinically Oriented Embryology"
Keith L. Moore
5th Edition, Philadelphia, W.B. Saunders Co. (1982)
ISBN 07216 4662-X $33.95

The work by Prof. Keith Moore is probably the most detailed study of the subject. Prof. Keith Moore is Professor and Chairman of the Department of Anatomy, University of Toronto.

His books on anatomy and on embryology are used at many medical school as standard instruction books. The Yale Medical school uses both his books. The Yale Bookstore phone number for Medical books is: (203) 772-2081. Their general information number is (203) 432-4771. (New Haven, Connecticut)

He is *the* authority on embryology. I strongly recommend the latest edition of the latter book as it mentions how accurately the Qur'an describes embryo development.

Prof. Moore has said: "It has been a great pleasure for me to help clarify statements in the Qur'an about human development. It is clear to me that these statements must have come to Muhammed from God or Allah because almost all of this knowledge was not discovered until many centuries later. This proves to me that Mohammed must have been a messenger of God or Allah."

Prof. Marshal Johnson, Professor and Chairman of the Department of Anatomy and Director of the Daniel Baugh Institute, Thomas Jefferson University, Philadelphia

He says: "The Qur'an describes not only the development of external form but emphasizes also the internal stages -- the stages inside the embryo of its creation and development, emphasizing major events recognized by contemporary science.... If I were to transpose myself into that era, knowing what I know today and describing things, I could not describe the things that were described. I see no evidence to refute the concept that this individual Mohammed had to be developing this information from some place, so I see nothing in conflict with the concept that Divine Intervention was involved..."

To receive a copy of the article that Moore wrote about 'Highlights of Human Embryology in the Koran and Hadith' please e-mail Adam at adam3@netcom.com

That leaves us to our third option: God wrote it!

May Allah Guide Us All to Straight Path. Ameen.

QURAN: Chapter 4, Verse 82: "Do they not consider (ponder) on the Quran? If it had been from anyone except Allah, they would surely have found in it much discrepency (contradictions)."

^
all sited and quoted.

Mary wasn't inspired by God to write a chapter, that is why she doesn't have a book named after her ;)

Just thought that was interesting as I have actually had this conversation a lot the last week or 2 lol.

In the Bible it has certain books authored by Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Paul, David... does the Quran not have that?

The post did not either state that Mary wrote or was inspired to write, and it didn't state the verses were just named after her name, but actually wholly ABOUT her and Jesus Christ, it was stating how much she is Honored in the Quran, where it could have been the Prophet's mother or daughter "as Muslims" to be honored if it was the Prophet who wrote it, we believe she was purified and is chosen above all women on earth. But anyway as I said, that was in reply to the question AND according to an Islamic point of view. We all have our own beliefs.

--
and no, it does not have that, the verses have titles, they have no authors, neither, and no one has ever claimed to have written them.

Hmmm.....quite an interesting post Ran....

But don't you think the quran might actually be a book written by a multitude of writers....our I might just be speaking rubbish

But no I mean look at it...don't you think the Quran you read today is not the actual thing which was actually written...it us a book which might have been originally written I don't know how many years ago...and it must have definitely went through a multitude of changes....many people reading it and improvising on it...and the result you read today...

Even the Shakespeare you read today has many variation from the actual thing that Shakespeare wrote (my teacher tells me so)
If plays and dramas written just around 400 years ago have gone through changes....
Don't you think a book...a holy book....written extremely many years ago must have gone through many many changes....
and about the credibility of the author of holy books...i ask, can you really tell...any holy book....i mean..these were written 1000's of years ago and many a times....okay I'll stop

Like for example...the mahabharat...if you know it...i find utterly disgusting and some mere story created by some fool...it is not really a book FYI...it is said to be some war in history and blah blah blah...and really I don't even believe one part of it...
If you wanna know anything about it...pm me...I'll tell you the nonsense things done in it...

By the way...

Is is known who wrote the Bible???

And the bhagwad geeta??? (there was a name..now slipping from my mind)