Wow, you think religious hatred is bad in the U.S

I believe religion & countries are two totally different things. Your religion does not make you worthy of being a citizen somewhere or not, because what you believe in makes who you are. Say the king of this country where he pushes everybody to be his religion, and then one day he realizes he believes something else. Does that change the policy of the country? :S or the way he & his gouvernment work together? Just the thought of being hatred for what you believe in, what you stand for, to be physically abused for what you do.. I can't bare it. This doesn't make sense, does it?

x

I think that, after learning all the things they need to know about a religion and think it worthy to follow, people should have the freedom to believe what they want. However, if this religion, or cult, is abusive and violent to society or an individual, then it's the gov'ts responsibility to protect it's citizens and step in.

I believe that government should have nothing to do with religion, only to contain it, such as you stated above.

Government should not be able to say what your religion is, but they should be able to contain certain types of religion such as sacrifice of humans or dogs...ect.

I hope this makes sense.

xTheEcstasyOfSuicidex

All religion is stupid. Which works out fine because so is all government. Organize yourself a religion, and sooner or later a government is going to come and opress it. Form a government and sooner or later you will piss off a religion who will want to destroy you. Peace-loving lot, these religions of the world.

Sometimes anarchy seems such an attractive proposition.

"All religion is stupid"

Is that an argument Ed? Cause it looks like a pretty thoughtless general statement, but regardless onto topic.

I used to practice Falun Gong [sp] and though I never got into the spiritual side of it, or the philosophical side I should say I met several Native Chinese people who could never go home because they were marked by the Goverment...I mean all they are doing is practising Tai Chi type movements and talking about peace, love and free expression! Which of course you can see is a big threat to an oppression regime!

Yay to seperation of faith and politics, faith in politics and politics in faith.

I am sorry but I kind of agree with Ed, but I will tweek it a bit.

All religions that fail to mordernize is stupid.

Falun Gong (sp) may be good in paper, like Marxism, or what it is now called Communism. I think that it's application to the mordern world, it may seem barbaric Falun Gong I mean (sp). So I think religion should mordernize rather than shun. Because we live in an age, where racism, sexism and homophobia is a thing of the past.

P.S: Politics and religion do not mix, I repeat do not mix. Just like religion and Science.

PPS: Oh and Bob, I would like to ask you to cite where it says that "placed people into concentration camps for believing in this practice. While there they were brutally beated, raped and tortured. Also there is an ongoing investigation that they were removing body parts and selling them on the black market, to people willing to pay for a liver, heart, cornea, etc....These parts were taken while the person was still alive, and they eventually ended up dying..."

Thank You.

“Somewhere between 70 and 76 armed agents from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms (ATF) prepared to move on a group of wooden buildings outside the central Texas town of Waco. Known as the Mount Carmel Center, the place was occupied by members of an apocalyptic religious group that was led by a man named David Koresh. Rumored to be stockpiled inside was an arsenal of explosives and weapons, some of which reportedly had been illegally converted to rapid-fire automatic.
That put them under the ATF's jurisdiction. A UPS driver had tipped off the government when a package bound for Mount Carmel had broken open to reveal casings for hand grenades. While the group did earn money from gun sales and were legally allowed to trade in arms, it appeared that they weren't following protocol. Some neighbors also reported a lot of target practice.
But there was more, too, which came out in the days ahead. Linedecker claims that the local newspaper was running a series of articles about Koresh's dubious activities, entitled "The Sinful Messiah," based on accounts by defectors like Marc Breault, who later authored Inside the Cult. Breault had hired detectives to snoop around and when contacted by the ATF, he supplied a number of detailed descriptions of his former associates. He denounced Koresh, speaking of child abuse and polygamy.”

Do you believe it is possible that there were cases of child abuse, polygamy, and resisting arrest in Waco?

I can only say that if I had my choice between spending my day in a church, or a government project, I would rather be in the church

“Falun Gong (Falun Dafa) was introduced to the public by Li Hongzhi on May 13, 1992 in Changchun, Jilin. According to Li, Falun Gong is an advanced "cultivation system" in the "Buddha School" which, in the past, was handed down to chosen disciples and served as an intensive "cultivation method" that required practitioners with extremely high “Xinxing” (mind-nature; heart-nature; character) or “great inborn quality.” Li taught the practice for three years and since then Falun Gong has also been promoted by practitioners themselves voluntarily. Falun Gong quickly grew in popularity in China, and starting in 1996 Li has introduced the practice to other countries
Li’s first teacher reportedly introduced him to the cultivation of truth, compassion and forbearance (zhen, shan, ren)”

“P.S: Politics and religion do not mix, I repeat do not mix. Just like religion and Science”

I know I continue to sound like a spiritual Pollyanna, but in my opinion the common denominator between, religion, politics, and science should be truth
Truth must be discovered and not invented

I mean no disrespect to the late great John Lennon. But it seems easier for me to imagine a world in unity with religion, politics, and science

The problem is that worldwide religion, politics and science is not in full communion with the truth
I have read theories that humans will evolve a sixth sense, and will know when someone is not telling the truth

Unfortunately I don’t need a reading from Edgar Cayce to tell when politicians are not presenting the facts accurately. I just check to see if their lips are moving

But what truth Micheal?

If we look at a scientific standpoint, it will thoroughly contradict with religion. I can go one way to say that from an evolutionary persuation and say that we as homo sapiens invented religion as a way to in lamen terms survive and not see their existance as nothing more as worm chow. I may be debated on this, but that is what I understood from it.

If we apply religion which hasn't mordernised to a mordern political society. It would be no better than the middle ages we are trying so desperately to escape.

I hate to argue Micheal, but how can you generalise truth, when there are so many out there that do deserve their own spotlight.

I am sorry if I have ever attempted to generalize the truth
You may be surprised that the late Pope believed that there is enough evidence available to prove the theory of evolution about the same time he overturned the condemnation of the catholic scientist Galileo who was condemned as a heretic for publishing of a book that supported the heliocentric theory

The Catholic Church is modernizing The Dalai Lama was welcomed to a catholic monastery in 1996

Government, religion, and science are here to stay, and truth should be their goal

Interesting idea Noir, to modernise religion. To me though, and this is only a personal idea, trying to modernise religion, and by that I mean the old ones is like trying to fix up an old car with new parts so that it can be up to speed with the recent motor inventions. It might be able to hold even but it will never excel or be anything more than basic.

Religion as a basic concept, even just as an idea, the we should believe in anything greater than ourselves, is just not relevant anymore in a time where we must all stand up and take personal responsibility for this world and everything that happens in it.

No praying to any God when conflict comes....
no mediatating on our chakra's when we feel challenged
No reading tarot cards and horoscopes to give us direction.

Of course I am saying all this like I'm Captain crusader..

Since you want to be so down to earth Kevin. The principle of the wheel that makes the automobile possible has the same basic principle it did when it was used on the roman chariots

The basic principles of internal combustion engines are still in use
Truth is as constant as each of the combustions in those engines. An air fuel mixture compressed, and ignited with no opposing variable will combust 100% of the time

The egocentric theory is as flawed in our spiritual world as the geocentric theory was flawed in our physical world
The Chinese communist government is not following the basic principles of wholesome spiritual truth, compassion, and tolerance.

I am not apologising. All religion IS stupid. The very notion that each faith believes itself to be the One True Faith (with very few exceptions) makes the notion inherently stupid. This is not to say that the religious are inherently stupid. Quite the reverse, in fact. To get people to believe in the concept of One True Faith is in itself an incredibly intelligent thing to do.

Yeah what ever happened to love thy neighbor

Even the word love has corrupted to the point that it is something we are supposed to make instead of receive

I am not the only one trying to reinvent the wheel

“Oh the wheel in the sky keeps on turning”

And now for something totally different
Fǎlún Gōng; literally "Practice of the Wheel of Law")

http://orad.dent.kyushu-u.ac.jp/dylan/ishallbereleased.html

I agree with you (Micheal) on saying Truth is constant, but isn't also variable, in that there are things that have different truths to the same things. An example of that would be a general concept of religion or science or if we go truly indepth we can look at a catholic view and a protestant view on christianity.

I also agree with you (Kevin) when you say that mordernizing religion would be like adding new parts to an old car. But don't you think that it should be a solution to these problems, I mean what was acceptable back then, wouldn't be acceptable now. Pedestary was acceptable in the old age, and now it is nothing more than common paedophilia.

So again, I say we should mordernize religion, because not only will it help alleviate tensions between religions, but it will at least stop all these nonsense that is going on with the world like fundamentalism and terrorism.

One question I would like to ask, all of you:

Do you think religions are competing with each other to see which one of them is right?

I believe those that examine religion very closely, realize that religion is a very powerful force. One of my favorite historical presentations was ”crusades” ,on the history channel
Terry Jones did an outstanding job making it entertaining. I don’t see how anyone can say that the whole idea of the crusades were not stupid. Likewise no one can deny that religion was the powerful force that motivated commoners to leave their families to kill innocent people in the name of Christ

Religion also seems to be the powerful force that steered an airplane into the twin towers on 911.

My favorite scene in the remake of the “Flight of the Phoenix” is when one of the characters explains the difference between spirituality, and religion. He said, in his opinion, religion divides people while spirituality unites people. So the characters which were very diverse managed to work together to prove that principles that work on a small scale, also work on a large scale

If we eliminated everything that could be abused in this world, what would we be left with?

The answer to the question; “Do you think religions are competing with each other to see which one of them is right?”

Religion is a powerful force that can be used for good, or evil. According to the biblical account it was the powerful religious leaders that called for the crucifixion of Jesus.

True Christians believe that God took the greatest evil, and turned it into the greatest good through the mystery of the Holy Trinity

Having said that, it seems it has taken many Christians centuries to learn the value of truthfulness compassion, and, forbearance

I am not in favor of any government attempt to control wholesome spirituality

I am in favor of any healing through spirituality of any kind

I absolutely love that last poetic statement Bob

I think that Kevin is probably right that no matter how hard we try, it is difficult to keep religion out of politics and politics out of religion. It is also difficult to determine why humans want to act like idiots
I would like to rephrase my statement about the terrorist attack because I am not sure if it has anything at all to do with what the propaganda suggest, which is that Osama bin Laden who could have lived a life of leisure and comfort organized Islamic militants known as al-Qaeda to punish the infidels that defiled sacred ground, but who in hell knows?

edit

“I agree with you (Micheal) on saying Truth is constant, but isn't also variable, in that there are things that have different truths to the same things. An example of that would be a general concept of religion or science or if we go truly indepth we can look at a catholic view and a protestant view on Christianity”.

One of my favorite stories that addresses the perception of reality is very oriental

In the story of the blind men and the elephant each man feels a different part of the elephant and perceives a portion of the truth about what an elephant is like

Morality seems to be evolving as you say

My great grandmother was a rebel, and my great grandfather fought on the union side

There does seem to be variables on moral truths or how we perceive right and wrong

Morality seems to be more subjective than say the truth that the earth revolves around the sun rather than the illusion that the sun travels around a stationary earth

After all of my rambling I cannot resist a quote from my favorite poet Kahlil Gibran

“Is not religion all deeds and all reflection,
And that which is neither deed nor reflection, but a wonder and a surprise ever springing in the soul, even while the hands hew the stone or tend the loom?
Who can separate his faith from his actions, or his belief from his occupations?
Who can spread his hours before him, saying, "This for God and this for myself; This for my soul, and this other for my body?"

”So again, I say we should mordernize religion”

Do you mean “we “as in the 6,557,039,523 people on this planet?

How long do you think it will take? ”We “ better get busy

Sorry …I could not resist a bit of humor…

Let there be peace on earth, and let it begin with me